From a recent 1/3 game I played. Table has a massive whale that just busted and went to the atm to reload for the 6(?)th time or so. Table should theoretically tighten up until he gets back, but may not be true in practice.

Hero (550$) - YAG UTG+1, probably tighter image given todays play. Been at the table a few hours.
V1 (~$900)- Mid 50's WG in CO. Tight reg. Value focused, still capable of bluffs
V2 (~$900)- Late 20's early 30's Indian guy OTB. Crafty reg? Seen some high equity bluffs. Seems familiar with the local pros and may be one as well, but hard to tell. Was talking about how he lost ~5500 in a big 1/3 game the other day, but didn't seem to play overtly fishy.

OTTH

Pre: Hero opens AcAh to $20 (larger size but had been common with the whale involved so I kept it). V1 and V2 call, rest fold.

Flop (60): Ks10d7d Hero bets 45, V1 calls, V2 raises to 145, Hero and V1 call.

Turn (495): 5s Hero x, V1 bets 300, V2 jams, Hero?


Happy with pre. I think flop cbet is fine, targeting Kx, lots of draws and pair + backdoor type hands. The flop reraise makes me a tad sick but obviously cant fold yet. I do think V1 is more draw focused when he calls twice. Maybe diamonds or QJ type hands. Open to discussion on flop sizing.

Turn the hand obviously goes off the rails. I normally don't get too attached to overpairs when people are jamming multiway but this hand was kind of an exception. The board has so many draws or hands willing to get it in at this point like QJdd, QJss, AKdd or AKo with a spade, KQdd, maybe KQ with a spade and very few 2 pairs and no possible straights/flushes. I do think I'm losing to V2 with a set of 10's, 7's, or possibly KT at some frequency which I can redraw to some paired boards. I also do NOT block any of the Ax flush draws, especially diamonds which was kinda key for me since he can now have like AQdd or something as well. I'm getting ~3:1 and was just super unsure. I did end up calling, will post results later

Overall pre is fine, flop cbet is fine. Calling the xr on the flop maybe the infliction point. If you call the xr and a basic brick comes on the turn, why not just jam turn?

But AP when V1 who you describe as value heavy leads out I would fold very quickly. I expect that one of these two easily has K10 or a set most likely V1 and V2 is on the draw.

I fold turn when V2 jams his 300BB stack into V1s 300BB stack after V1 shows a lot of strength. You have to tighten up given you have a player left to act behind you. It’s pretty hard for both players to have a monster combo draw. So what does the other guy have? It will suck if you get shown AK by V1 and combo draw/KdXd from V2. But I think this is relatively uncommon. Too lazy to check equity in equilab.

I think V1 did you a solid ott, 300 into 500 after that flop action is just so strong.

Ez fold, nh.

Hundred on top, vs two other players is usually strength rather than a draw. We don't have a diamond but that doesn't mean he must be on a FD. Heads up would be an easier call to the raise but when you add another player in the mix it only makes his bet that much stronger towards value instead of bluffs.

Calling the flop is ok but the turn is an easy as can be fold.

Not sure how multiway might impact these numbers (I assume it gets worse for me) but gave them a look in flopzilla from the turn.

If the 'combined' V range is 77, TT, KK+, diamond/spade QJs/KQs/AKs, and all KT, I have 23% equity boosted to 30% if I include half combos of AKo. I felt like I was being a bit too sticky with the call and seems like it may be the case, but maybe not awful. I need ~24% equity assuming V1 calls behind me which I assume he will.

If V1 was doing the squeezing flop, I think I'm more likely to get away, but V2 was definitely more likely to pull shenanigans and I figured board pairing the 7/5 was still outs most of the time.

Definitely agree its an easier call heads-up, I think I just need to let go multi-way here.

What do you think your range looks like to the Villains? You raised pre, and bet/called the flop. The worst you have here is probably KQ or something like KJdd. And yet, two Villains are piling the turn. I don't see how we are good here often enough.

If those are the ranges you have for Vs then I guess it’s a call. But I’d remove the AK from V2 cause I’d think a player who runs big bluffs would 3! pre with AK, and I’d remove KK+ from both players due to preflop. Are you giving both players the offsuit combos of KT? I think those are definitely in range.

On first glance I didn’t notice the BDFD came in, and that does add a few additional combos of draws for V2, I suppose. Don’t think V1 has a draw given his line though. I wouldn’t give him the QsJs type stuff.

Anyway, 25% equity is the break even point for you to GII assuming V1 calls (reasonable assumption, I think). So if your ranges are accurate and your equity is that high then go with it?

V1 flats a flop x/r multiway, then donks the turn on a brick, then V2 jams, this is an easy fold.

TT/77/KTs are all in their range. 89dd, JTdd, KQdd, KJdd, AJdd can play like this, I guess A5dd now. Maybe some other NFDs. Don't see any AK in their range. No-one does this with TP without the A kicker or a backup draw.

I think very optimistically you're against a couple of draws OTT but more likely someone has a set and you are crushed. This is the type of situation that I quietly fold and 90% would have gotten stacked if I called.

EDIT

I think this range is not unreasonable? All the NFDs except AK plus some combo draws gives us ~15%:

Board: T7K
Equity Win Tie
MP2 15.53% 15.19% 0.34% { AhAc }
MP3 42.24% 41.81% 0.43% { TT, 77, KTs, AdQd, KdQd, AdJd, KdJd, JdTd, Ad9d, Ad8d, 9d8d, Ad6d, Ad5d, Ad4d, Ad3d, Ad2d }
CO 42.24% 41.81% 0.43% { TT, 77, KTs, AdQd, KdQd, AdJd, KdJd, JdTd, Ad9d, Ad8d, 9d8d, Ad6d, Ad5d, Ad4d, Ad3d, Ad2d }

We go all the way up to ~29% if they have all combos of AK, which I think would be excessively optimistic:

Board: T7K
MP2 28.94% 28.49% 0.45% { AhAc }
MP3 26.61% 25.95% 0.66% { AKs, KTs, AdQd, KdQd, AdJd, KdJd, JdTd, Ad9d, Ad8d, 9d8d, Ad6d, Ad5d, Ad4d, Ad3d, Ad2d, AKo }
CO 44.45% 43.96% 0.49% { TT, 77, AKs, KTs, AdQd, KdQd, AdJd, KdJd, JdTd, Ad9d, Ad8d, 9d8d, Ad6d, Ad5d, Ad4d, Ad3d, Ad2d, AKo }

Then if we give CO some combos of AK including AKdd and button none, we get ~21%:

Board: T7K
Equity Win Tie
MP2 21.17% 20.74% 0.43% { AhAc }
MP3 27.17% 26.50% 0.66% { AKs, KTs, AdQd, KdQd, AdJd, KdJd, JdTd, Ad9d, Ad8d, 9d8d, Ad6d, Ad5d, Ad4d, Ad3d, Ad2d, AdKh, AdKs, AdKc, AsKd }
CO 51.67% 51.24% 0.43% { TT, 77, KTs, AdQd, KdQd, AdJd, KdJd, JdTd, Ad9d, Ad8d, 9d8d, Ad6d, Ad5d, Ad4d, Ad3d, Ad2d }

“Talking about how he lost 5k but didn’t seem too fishy” - at low levels people who talk about losing a lot is a tell that they aren’t a total fish. They tend to only discuss wins, or worse lie about winning when they lost. Your play seems fine but I fold here. It’s a really bad spot for a 1/3 game. Seems like a lag type game where you’ll get better spots.
Also not saying you should fold to reraise on flop( you shouldn’t w/o reads, you played flop correctly) but you are allowed to fold there. When you’re beat you’re beat. You would need a strong read to make the fold on flop. It is an interesting spot. I’d feel uneasy and just fold.

Seems to be an issue with the boards. Shouldn’t you put the 5s out there to get the turn equity?

Yep, my bad. Doesn't change things much suprisingly. We get ~16% in first scenario, ~26% in second and ~18% in third.

[FONT=courier new][SIZE=12]
Board: T7K 5
Equity Win Tie
MP2 18.53% 18.53% 0.00% { AhAc }
MP3 36.32% 36.07% 0.25% { TT, 77, AKs, KTs, AdQd, KdQd, AdJd, KdJd, JdTd, Ad9d, Ad8d, 9d8d, Ad6d, Ad5d, Ad4d, Ad3d, Ad2d, AdKh, AdKs, AdKc, AsKd }
CO 45.15% 44.90% 0.25% { TT, 77, KTs, AdQd, KdQd, AdJd, KdJd, JdTd, Ad9d, Ad8d, 9d8d, Ad6d, Ad5d, Ad4d, Ad3d, Ad2d }
[/SIZE][/FONT]

On mobile so will read/comment later but wanted to drop results

Always like seeing results so I can see how off my reads are.

The whale in the complicates things imo. Callers ranges pre. Who know with whale, V2 capped. AK for V2 unlikely he might 3 bet pre and you have 2 of the Aces. On the flop worrying a lot about a set from V2, he is at least a very good hand imo. V2 knows whale is not folding a made hand. I think call on the flop is fine. I would give it up on the turn. V2 range got stronger. Thinking whale might have picked up a spade flush draw on the turn.

Edit: Did not notice spoiler so my comments were made without reading it.

Noob perspective:

Pre is standard.

Flop is fine, though you could also consider a 3-bet (even jam) on a fairly connected board. V2 sounds capable of a squeeze play in position, so you could 3-bet and put him in a tough spot. But flatting would probably accomplish just as much if he's actually just bluffing and would probably ease off on the turn, whereas if he has it, you're screwed. All that said, no complaints.

Turn as played is just a fold for me. V2 raised flop into multiple players, now is raising turn again into multiple players on a connected board. This smells an awful lot like 77 or maybe TT concerned about straight or flush possibilities on the river. If he were playing a draw, I think this would have just been a call on the turn. And there's still V1 to consider, who seized the initiative on this street and probably isn't going away in the face of that jam.


After seeing the results: I'm not surprised V1 had a massive combo draw, but I'm still convinced V2 hit a set on the flop, thought he was ahead the whole way, and was disgusted that the draw got there.

I limp/reraise in EP. Deep in troublesome SPR pots multiway to tricky players OOP (especially with a tight image where I'm unlikely to get 3bet)? Not the wheelhouse I'm aiming for, but if its yours then obviously fine.

I think I check the flop a lot just to underrep, less chance of turning my hand face upish, less chance of encountering stoopid spots, and more chance of just getting to showdown. Facing the raise is one of those stoopid spots I'd really like to avoid. Against ABC players, we can just bet/fold. But we probably don't feel comfortable doing that here. Problem is that if we call we'll likely just have a 75% PSB left; now what? Are we cool with committing huge stacks having gotten in just lol 3.5% preflop?

Turn is super weird with V1 waking up on a complete blank. But V2 still seems cool enough with his hand and our hand reads as AK. Think I probably hero fold here but I likely hero fold too much.

Overall, I really feel like I'm grasping at straws in this spot, so I do everything in my power (playing preflop differently, checking flop) to play more to a wheelhouse that I'm comfortable with. The more you feel you're not completely grasping at straws here, then I guess the cooler you are getting yourself into these spots.

GcluelessNLnoobG

Yeah, that disgusted look can only be a set that got rivered by a draw for 300BB.

That feeling sucks. As you can probably tell, I've been in that position once too often. Also, if I had a set on the flop, that's exactly how I would play it in a live low stakes game.

Hopefully V2 wasn’t angry at H because H all in call increased V2 EV.