Yeah, ur right. Plus villain has ego issues. If hero categorized villain as a good LAG this would be a bad play imo though. But ya, he's probably not folding too often if we re-raise, though he may be folding KQ in that spot pre.

If we just raise pre villain might 3 bet, especially short handed, and we don't risk a 4 way limped pot.

Villain getting dealt KQs here is pretty fortunate.

1st elcebro I want to thank you, the hands you post are seriously some of the few that actually get me to think.
2nd wp, you always go into the hands with a plan. regardless if everyone agrees or not, you have a plan and stick to it.

What do you do if Q comes otr and he ships? What about a club?
Same questions if he checks.

1st post in a long time...are people seriously advocating not putting in a single raise, with kings, on the button, two players still left to act, vs. a total lagtard in the straddle?!?! I mean, congrats you won the hand, so haters gonna hate i guess...but I just can't fathom ever letting an opponent dictate the action the way you let yours. All you accomplish by playing this passively is you allow him to seize the initiative on every street, to dictate the price he has to pay to see another card for whatever draws may be in his range, and lose out on the massive value that is likely to be gotten against such a loose opponent. What's more, the longer you wait to get your money in the middle the more likely it is he can get away. What if a club or ace falls on the river and kills your action? Or even worse, what if he shoves then? Are you really confident enough in your reads to snap him off then? I guess if your plan was to call off three streets regardless of the action--which is an awful plan--and if you honestly believed he'd fire three streets with an inferior hand, your plan works. Otherwise, despite winning the hand, you played it way too passively.

I know that would be a standard play, but the question is: can nonstandard starting conditions warant a nonstandard play here?

At the very least I'd raise pre. Depending on the board texture you can let him hang himself, but what happens if he had 10/5o in his straddle? Is he raising then?

I'd save letting him make moves for post flop.

I get what you're saying but is there a scenario where you would raise this guy without either a draw/bluff or a monster and if not will he notice?

As for this particular situation I think it's probably max +EV to play it this way, but that also means you should be bluff raising villain pretty wide in the future if his calling range is so tight.

Some food for thought:
1) In general, what % of his total range is firing as a bluff on flop, turn, and river?
2) What % of his total betting range is for value?
3) What % of his value betting range is calling if we raise flop? And will those hands still call turn and river?

I think that in theory if villain is more likely to put more chips in the pot by bluffing and thinly value betting than calling then the more +EV play is to let villain do all the betting for us to keep his betting range as wide as possible.

Like raising preflop when it gets to you first on the button. If you are a solid player and you have a history with him and know he will defend his straddle why not raise, there is a good chance he could 3 bet and then you could play it passively from there.

As played preflop, raise flop and maybe check turn for pot control and bet for value on river.

T5o he is unlikely raising. T5s he does. He raises ~60% of the hands (as written in OP).

@ MacGuyV

Sorry I don'r exactly understand what are you asking. Do i ever raise him with a marginal hand postflop? Think not, and so what?

Basically this:
If your flop/turn raise induces him to fold so much then isn't it better to address that in other hands by bluff raising as opposed to letting him barrel off on the rare occasion you have an overpair?

OP, would you say the villain is...dangerous?

I like the call on the flop, but when he leads the turn you have to raise

Oh that. I do raise him as a bluff when I feel he is wide. He, bstrd, has a habit of sometimes 3betting AI post flop quite light, when he reads me as raising light. But I do not raise him wwith TP/OP kind of hands, cause it is more proffitable, IMO, to let him keep firing.

Why do I have to raise turn?

@ The Shrog.
Yes.

Sorry was the river bet an all in bet? Or did he leave money behind?

i was wondering the same thing, but it appears to be an all-in. if it isn't it's terrible.

I think it does.

As Hero, I'd be worried about 2 cards: 1) A 2) Q
If he has b/d flush, which is possible, thats just life sometimes.

Villains line seemed very consistent for a big Q. And by c/c multiple streets with an overpair, you really destroy the dangerous lag mentality of b/f 3 streets with hands like top pair.

I think this was a strong, disciplined play that resulted in felting an opponent for ~200BB (100 after what looked like a straddle). If your villain was a good LAG, he may otherwise be able to fold one pair, where instead your line causes a LAG to maximize your value. As your villain is not top caliber, it resulted in him going into turbo-spew mode; which is always the nuts

What kind of spots would he read you as raising light then? I would think this would be an ideal spot for it as you could be raising on a flush draw if you raise the flop. Whatever line causes him to spaz out and put as many chips in the middle as possible in the long run is the line we want to take vs him.

Keep in mind especially with villains talk he is putting hero on a weak made hand or a flush draw. So don't forget the fact that he is lag and by flatting you not only cause him to incorrectly value-bet, but you keep in his bluffing range that may just expect us to fold on rivers that don't look like they help us or complete our suppossed draw. by flatting flop and turn we are maximizing value from both his air and his value hands. If you raise flop you take out all of his air, and he will slowdown and maybe just call one time then fold on turn to further agression. Calling keeps him firing multiple streets with his entire range except weak 2nd pair type hands that might want a cheap showdown. In which case piling money in would just cause him to fold flop/turn anyways.

Example was then I called his raise IP with a middle PP, board came out 79A, I raised him otf, he 3bet shoved T8o into my face.

I think this is going to be a lot closer then if he will 3 bet shove the flop with flush draws, and if he knows you are capable of raise/folding the flop I don't see how he can lay down a queen against you on a drawy board such as this. So a queen and flush draws make up roughly 1/3 of his range, so 1/3 of the time you are getting him to stick in $340 on the flop which comes out to ~$112 on average.

To give a little perspective, if he barrels the turn 100% of the time if the flush card misses and only value bets TP or better with no flush on the board on the river then turn expectation is ~$66 [$80*(100-(9/52))], where 9/52 are flush cards and cards that he won't barrel unless he has a flush, and river expectation is ~$50 ($260*19%), where 19% is a rough estimate of his value range where value range is TP+. So $66+$50=$116. And that's only if he barrels the turn 83% of the time with air, which is a pretty big stretch.

Therefore if we raise flop and he 3 bet jams on us with TP+ and a flush draw, which is roughly 33% of his preflop raising range, then raising flop is probably the most +EV line.

Exactly how I see it. Give this guy the opportunity to break himself before scare cards come out. Aggression = best answer

What I'm going to say might not make sense but you can play KK much more aggressively vs a LAG than a TAG. Flat calling with KK is good vs a TAG to keep his range wide but raising is good vs a LAG because his range is going to be wide regardless.

Makes a lot of sense.

this guy was never folding a queen on this board unless a bad card came off.

How do I know he has a Queen on the flop?

He bets like his whole 60% preflop range on the flop. He is continiung with much less if I raise (can't stove now but maybe like 15%?).
Otherwise he is betting like 40% of pre range ot. Amount of money in the pot if he calls flop raise = amount of oney he bets turn.
I can always bet myself if he shutdowns on any street.
If he bets turn, I only have a PSB left.

Again, IMO his betting range for the next street >> his calling range on a given street. With raise size = next street bet size, passive line results in a bigger pot.