Played $5/5 with $500-$1k buyin, my normal game is $2/$3 with 100-300 Buy in. I buy in for 100BBs at both. This was my first 5/5 session and it came after 8 consecutive 2/3 booked wins. I have the roll for it, the issue is my comfort and skill, and more importantly; their skill. I played $2/$3 for three hours first before moving up, and noticed a much more aggressive table dynamic, no short stacks, almost no limping allowed. I know on this forum people group the 1/2 - 3/5 villains as very similar, but that was not my observation. At least at this one table.

First small question: What, if any, small strategy adjustments do you make in a game where the SB and BB are the same VS the usual set up where SB is 33-50% of the BB? I know the pot is a touch bigger pre, and obv SB gets the same price as BB... but are there any small strat tweaks?

On to the hand:

As I said, very aggressive table. People winning and losing buy-ins quickly. The players seem to all be thoughtful with one "Old Man Coffee Nit" type and one "I Love to Gamble and I Suck" Loose/passive type. The rest of the players seem "good" to me. Woman called off a pot sized river c-raise after a lot of thought, holding just 3rd pair because the river CR made no sense to her as she replayed the hand. It seemed like real 2+2 **** going on. I was down $150 from seeing flops missing, and getting raised off draws. Then I was able to make a good read of my own and double up one orbit ago. Current stack $706.

Hero on BTN with QQ

UTG+2 (one of the seemingly thoughtful winning players, who knows everyone in the cardroom, and has ~$1.5k) opens to $15
Hero raises to $45
blinds fold
UTG+2 thinks for a while and raises to $145

-With this decision I thought about my stack size and my image. I look young and internet kid-ish, people tend to think I'm not very good. I get paid off a lot more than I should because people think I can't have anything, and so it takes a lot of folding before I can successfully bluff. Here, if I fall in love with the Queens and 4B it would be in that weird area of like $400... which is well over 1/2 my stack invested pre, completely committed... so I thought it was essentially a $700 bet. I wasn't anxious to get so much in pre, because I feel that bet ONLY gets called by better and I can't get paid, while I just hand him my stack when he has KK/AA. So I decided to use my position and flat.

Flop ($300 - rake): 8 2 4r

Villian checks
Hero bets $200

-Is this too much/little? Would this be a good place to check instead since he slowed down after his 3B pre? I welcome all thoughts and criticism. At the moment I was thinking I wanted to make a bet that committed me since I really like this flop and his check made me not worry so much about KK/AA anymore. I was happy to try to take it down OTF and also happy to get it in OTF is he raised. I didn't want to slowplay and see one of the scare cards.

Please let me know what you think of my line, as well as my logic.

If he c/r what hands do you beat? AA and KK could definitely take a c/r line to get called by JJ/QQ on this dry board where they dont need protection.

If he c/c then you can probably fire the turn again for value. If he c/r, i dont think he has AK/JJ ever because your flat of the 4b reps QQ/JJ/TT/AK and i think youre likely to check back the bottom part of that range in a 4b pot.

so you advocate checking back?

This is all sounds good, but only if the Villain is playing in a straight-forward manner and would never try to push Hero off of a better hand. Unfortunately, against a solid, thinking player this hand (like the QQ vs. nit thread posted a few days ago) really becomes a leveling war, with no one correct strategy...except to use your position.

I would bet the flop.

Bet flop strong.

Sent from my Samsung Galaxy Note 2

No real adjustment is needed other than realizing that limp pots now have two players playing ATC, but since most players feel their SB prices them in and they complete anyways, the net effect is you really don't have to worry about it.

Oh, just thought of something. Personally, I use the SB as an opportunity to observe which players "fold" their SB. This is a good indicator of skill level. Winning players are going to fold more from the SB than losing players.

You are leveling yourself here. It doesn't matter how "people" think, it only matters what HE THINKS!!!

How has THIS table and THIS villain been responding to your raises? If you have been folding a lot at this table and not raising a lot, then your hand should be face up here as JJ+, AK. I mean, do you think villain has JJ/TT here and is putting you on TT/99, AQ??? I mean, if you haven't been raising a lot then why would this villain think you have TT/99, AQ??

So when villain 3-bets you, this villain's range is exclusively JJ+/AK and is heavily weighted to QQ+, AK unless you have given this villain a concrete reason to widen their range in response to you.

Or, if you noticed that this villain is 3-betting light? Has this villain been 3-betting more than is usual? These are the questions you need to ask yourself instead of leveling yourself about your appearance.

Your logic is a little off. If villain has AA/KK I could easily see this villain checking to induce you to bet with your JJ/QQ or even try to steal with AK which should be the majority of your range in this spot.

As far as you pot committing yourself??? This is a super easy bet/fold.

V's range is heavily weighted to QQ+. I don't expect V to c/r shove w AK. So if he calls or raises you, your QQ is done. If V had JJ he would have led out and not give a free card in the event you have AK since JJ is usually pathologically afraid of over cards...

So to me, this is more of a bet/fold unless we have a read that villain is 3-betting light. But you really didn't indicate that.

So, if V has been 3-betting light, then okay, we can stack off here. But if V has been more or less normal with his preflop raising/3-betting then this is a bet/fold

grunch:

Let me preface this with the fact that I have played very little 2/5 due to bank roll considerations, however, I've heard that it's mostly the same game, so I would say that you probably just got dealt a bad table. I'd say it's much more likely that youour perception is skewed due to increasing stakes. The chances are good that they aren't actually as good as you describe.

As for the hand...
You haven't really give a lot of info on this particular villain other than you think he's probably good.

If you look at this from the vilain's perspective, your range is something like QQ+, AK. If his range really is KK+, then it would make a lot of sense for him to check this hand and let you bet at it. If he has AK, it doesn't make any sense to check since that pretty much guarantees he can't continue unless he's planning a sick c/shove.

I don't mind checking back the flop. That's if you truly believe he's KK+ to 4 bet. If he has AK in his range, then betting makes more sense.

DGI: is there room to bet/fold? I don't recall the exact stack sizes.

I like either flatting his opening bet better than 3betting and dont like flatting the 4bet either. There is no reason to believe he is 4betting us light. His 4bet range has us crushed

Regarding the difficulty of the game, there are a couple factors that might be at play.

First, I think moving up is always a little scary. I remember the first time I played 2/5 and thinking "holy crap, these guys are good." But before long, I could see glaring mistakes.

Second, it might just be that you happened upon a table full of good players. There is definitely a wide range of play quality at any limit just due to random factors.

Third, is this the biggest game around? That could make a difference. My casino is the only one for 100mi and they offer 1/2, 2/5, and 5/10. There are a lot of players in the 5/10 who would play bigger if they could, and as a result, the 5/10 is really tough at times.

I fold preflop vs the 4bet. He has no reason to think you are light here, and the sizing he makes when he will have to play a large pot oop if you call makes me think he has no air, and no ak here.

As played I checkback the flop and try to get to showdown for 1 bet. For same reasons as above I don't think you need to worry that much about a or k turns. As played your flopbet is way too big. You have both shown heaps of strength here, him with the small 4bet, you with the 4bet flat and either of you can easily get the money in on two streets without bombing it on the dryest of all flops.

So we are bluffing the flop? If we think he has tt-jj here why would he 4 bet and then check/call the flop to give a free card to aq-ak? also why aren't we just ripping it pre if we think he is wide for value prelfop? 8x is about all that I think might check/call this flop and I didn't read anything that leads me to believe he can have that. This is also the safest of all boards to trap on.

you are still doing the same thing though on this flop just because he gave you the greenlight. you aren't folding out better with this flop bet, I'd be shocked if he was check jamming worse, which basically leaves you owning yourself here when you are coolered. If he is checking here with worse its mostly to give up and you can get your qq to showdown most likely.

And as others have pointed out, don't assume everyone here is a great player, don't feel like you have to overadjust. They have leaks like everyone else. Probably lots of them.

as far as blinds go, if ppl are folding up to the hijack-btn and those seats are opening light then there is an incentive to 3bet with a wide range when in the sb to get the bb to fold. its live poker though so I don't see this is happening all that often.

You are too shallow to fold QQ here. I like your flat pre.

If we call his 4-bet pre for $145, we should be getting it in on all safe flops.

If V is a good aggressive player then his 4-bet OOP range has a lot of AK, 99+ and some Airish hands mixed in since you are tight and doubled up so he probably sees you as scared money.

Stacking off with QQ for our 100 bbs left on an 8 hi flop when we got in so much pre is fine - I would sleep well if we lost.

If we bet and fold I would not sleep well - especially if V shows JJ or air.

My original post is all screwed up

I thought we were 3-betted, but a quick re-read and I see we were actually 4-betted

light 4-betting is extremely rare at the 5/5nl level. So take my original post and slide V's range up a couple of ticks...

The only hand in V's range we beat is AK. JJ is never in this villain's range unless he is super aggro. And if Hero has been playing snug with his preflop raising, than Hero's hand is face up as JJ+/AK

my post was a little off (see my corrections above). I agree, he never has TT-JJ here.

Taking a bet/fold line isn't a bluff. Also, our hand is vulnerable to being bluffed out. The problem I have in this spot is that if we let flop check through, then we show weakness. So then, when villain bets into us on turn, is he betting because he has AA/KK or is he betting because he has AK and he sensed weakness and knows the only way he can win is by bluffing? This ambiguity means we will have to call turn and river bets and get owned by AA/KK for significantly more than if we bet/fold.

I fold JJ/QQ all the time to 4-bets in 2/5nl because villains rarely 4-bet with AK. The vast majority of 4-bets in 2/5nl are AA/KK unless you are involved in a leveling war with villain or have been caught 3-betting light a lot and are seen as aggro spewy. Otherwise, when you get 4-bet at this level, you can be very confident that you are staring down the barrel of AA/KK and unless you have odds to set-mine, you will be correct in folding.

His bluffs will auto cbet this flop everytime except for the times they are giving up, and those give ups will usually continue to give up. plus based on his preflop sizing, we both now think he is likely to be really strong. Don't have to level yourself into calling because you "showed weakness" bet/folding flop is the easier play imo. checking it is the better play in this spot. Or if we really want to bet I like betting really small/folding. I'd do this with kk-aa here also so I don't fear getting c/r bluff owned. His check/calls vs a small bet will now be more hands that we beat, and his c/rs will mostly be kk-aa that feel the need to build the pot. I still like checking in this exact spot though, my 2 outer has huge implied odds and I'm really happy getting to showdown for cheap here since qq is usually good then.

I can get behind this

I prob fold to the 4bet. He leads a very high% with his air here, on this board. This smells like a set up for the c/r 'stack a donk' move.

I should clarify that the hand I doubled up in was when I c/r shoved the turn with JJ wheb flop of Kxx 2 spades went check check VS a different very Aggro opponent. When he checked that flop I knew he had no K, so when the turn blanked and he bet I shoved, he tank called with an under-pair stating "he knew I had no K", for same reason I did. River was q and I showed down JJ for the pot. So the table knows I'm not super tight, they saw me mix it up a little at least.

I appreciate the advice re: not over adjusting to stakes. That's good to think on. Seems a lot of different opinions re: check back or bet. I appreciate the different logics, thanks! I will say I never considered folding pre because V has been somewhat aggressive and I just shoved with an underpair after folding a lot, so he could be wider than normal, plus the pot was heads up when he 4b.