Is that your answer to me? There's just as many AK combos we can have shoving as there is stupid crap anyone could make up to put in flatting range.

You're 5b shoving AK in this spot at 1-2?

I think I'm snap folding AK to a 4b in a normal 1-2 game without a strong read on the 4bettor.

Now I'm going to say this again but this time @ gramuel, what stakes is this again?

I've said it to two of you now.

Teh stakes matter, nobody is going to exploit our flatting range in a 4-bet pot, and a lot of the times somebody is going to back raise, the other times UTG folds and maybe the 3-bettor comes along. Other times we go 4 way to the flop and we have an easy decision.

Our 4-bettors range is naturally wider than a typical 4-bet because of the ridiculous way this hand played out a min 3-bet does this. I expect him to have AKs here some times, maybe AQs (rare) and JJ+.

You push out too many of those hands with a push.

Now onto the AK thing, come on it's 1/2 or 1/3 wtv,it's not about us pushing AK it's about what others think we push, surely we can have some AK pushes here, the way this hand played out I don't think UTG is that strong, nor is UTG likely and the strongest of all the hands is probably our 4-bettor who I think we now block with AK and could actually justify a shove, but that's besides the point, AK is in the range for our opponents thinking, that's what his argument was.

It's not a question of what our actual flatting range is. It's a question of what our Vs think our flatting range is. And given how much most Vs at 1/2 can't imagine folding TT+ or AK pre to anything less than a shove, if they stop to think about our range at all, that's probably about where they'll put us.

You guys also overlook how often everyone raises and how almost nobody flats big PPs here. They probably almost always never suspect AA here.

How often do villains on your table jam or raise here with AA in your shoes?

So many good things going for you other than stakes/level of thinking villains.