Blinds $1-$2. Game is $2-$100 spread-limit. This is literally my first hand at the table so my stack is $300 exactly.

I see KcKd UTG 9-handed and limp in for $2. 5 other guys call. The Small Blind—who covers me—raises it up…to $42! BB folds.

Anyone like a call here and pray for a 7-high flop? Or is this pure raise to $142?

Why trolling? Raise pre.

I personally find preflop KK decisions to be the most compelling ones posted on these forums.

Fold and show the table

Shake your head in disappointment while tanking several minutes before finally saying, not doing this again, then muck faceup without saying anything else to anyone

Raise.

Raise, the amount doesn't matter because 2-100 SL and 300$ eff stack but I prefer one that ends in the number 2 to make it easier for V to call. like 102

To follow with the jokers in this thread, make sure to say "time to go home" before raising.

We’ve all played with the $1-$2 guy who “hates pocket Jacks” and consequently raises them to a stupidly high amount preflop to merely pick up $3 in Blinds.

We don’t often have pocket Kings against that guy.

I think it’s worth contemplating our options.

The limp is OK at these stakes. At higher stakes, you want to be somewhat balanced if you do this, because otherwise your hand is face up to regs.

You were probably planning for a raise and callers, but this sounds fine. I would raise to 142. You could make it smaller, but I doubt he folds that much of that much more when you max it. If he had AA, he would probably not want to take it preflop. So good chance this is JJ or maybe TT/AK, etc. He is not going to want to fold postflop, particularly if he gets a good flop.

If you really think he has JJ, think about how often you will end up with an action-freezing flop if you don't push your hand hard now. It's quite a bit more than you think.

fold, 3bet J3o

It's not a totally great spot, because you are even more face up than usual with a limp/3-bet doing that after he makes it 42. He is really unlikely to fold pre though. He probably has a mid pp, but you can't be sure is he has which of 99-QQ. He could also have AK maybe AQ. So if there are like 2 overcards or an ace when he has a pp or he misses with AK, you might not get so much action. You might not be able to continue strongly on some connected or A-high flops. He is stacking you though with a set, and you can't be sure it is JJ and not TT or whatever he has.

However, it is probably better playing that way than flat calling and seeing a flop maybe 4 ways.

Utg limp first hand is good, especially if you’re still settling down by unracking your chips and in the phone logging the session.

This guy isn’t folding, just make it 142 for easy stack off.

As much as I respect Sklansky and Malmuth, there is no reason to be limping KK on your first hand. Raise 7.

As played, easy 100 raise to teach people to respect your limps.

Raise to the max limit.

It is obvious OP would get a much better result flat calling 42 than opening to 10, unless the guy who made it 42 would have 3!.

Sklansky is right about sometimes limping at low stakes.

It is kind of a weird situation when you 3!, as you are both so face up, but hard someone who raises to 42 to fold.

And also someone raises to $42 every hand!

I don't understand what you are suggesting. Open raising to 42 every hand you want to play in ep? The other guy made in 42 over a bunch of limpers.

You could make huge raises in ep with premium hands and take the blinds at some tables. I see that all the time where fish will do that and show JJ, AK, AA, or whatever.

When you limp, and someone raises, it will usually be more over limpers than if you opened in ep. So if you had say AQ at a table where there are usually raises, there are some advantages to limping with the option to call and there would be a bigger pot than if you opened. Or you could 3!, representing KK+. If it is raised and 3!, you might limp/fold AQ. I don't agree with never limping, because limping is donkish or whatever.

I think many people in this thread are taking the piss. Tomark's post is referencing that this is OP's first hand at the table, and this villain has raised it to $42. So he's raised it to 42 every hand.

In seriousness on this hand, just 3bet to 100 total. Since it's $100 max bet, we can get all-in on the turn. Going to the max pre is unnecessary. I'd probably do the same in no-limit

142 is better if he never folds. What if he has tens and it comes QJx and he check folds flop? Let’s get the money while he’s ready to give it.

Yeah, there are bad flops for him and bad flops for you. He almost always has a pp or ace, so he has some outs. Plus, he is probably a donk and can't hand read, but your hand is almost always KK/AA when you limp/3! his huge raise, so you are even more face up than he is. So I don't like trying to lure him in with a tiny raise.

You said limping is good because getting raised to $42 and flatting is better than raising to $10, my point was its results oriented thinking.

The reason you raise to $15 (not 10 lmao this is low stakes) is because otherwise sometimes it limps thru, and because l/rr isnt as valuable as you think cuz it turns your hand face up AND anyone with 2 brain cells to run together (very few lowstakes players) should be AGGRESSIVELY 3 betting your EP raises once you l/rr cuz theyd realize your preflop raising range is capped.


Anothe reason not to limp is because its just simply not part of any kind of strategy with even quarter way competent opponents so if you have any real goals of moving up and playing for real money, youre wasting time implementing weird and stupid and situational strategies which arent widely applicable and likely arent even especially ev+.

You had me at LRR.

I have zero understanding of your wonky hybrid game, but the preflop limp is completely standard for me.

I probably just reraise as planned and don't get too tricky.

GcluelessLRRnoobG

I've been trying to understand it since reading my first Davo thread.

It seems to me that the bigger the pot gets as the hand progresses, the more it plays like a limit game, and the less like no limit, such that we'd want to apply max pressure and get max value on earlier streets, but become more showdown oriented as we approach the river. Any late street bluffs would seem less likely to get through if they're not a continuation of early street aggression.

This is why I suggested raising to the max. Hero got what he wanted when the SB raises over all the limps. Time to go for max value with KK in our LRR line.

I don't know if Davo's LRR strat is the ideal approach to manipulate the pot size pre, but it would seem in line with the overall strat of bloating the pot on earlier streets with thick value, to reduce the likelihood of being outdrawn or getting blown off our equity on later streets. I wonder if he's not seeing a trend of opponents who are inelastic when it comes to limping or calling a single raise, but who otherwise over-fold to big 3B's.

It's a weird dynamic, because if a limp/3-bet is ever a bluff, it pretty much cannot be one here. If you make it 100, you almost give him odds to set mine if he somehow reads you hand correctly.