haha... So funny to see live players being kinda happy of the current misery of their online peers.

You guys just don't realize atm that hell of a friday is bad news for you too.
But you will, soon enough....

poor live regs

gl, cya

Live players, you can't beat online poker because online poker pros>>>>> you. Now many online pros will play live. You wont be beating live games because online pros who switched to live>>>>>>>>>>> you. We dont want to take your job, and you dont want us to take it, so please help the PPA win us back our internets!

Wtf is wrong with you

i get that a lot of you are pissed off, and it's fun to make fun of live players, but now does not seem like the time to be antagonistic, divisive, or hostile.

This, seriously it's time to actually work together and do something, not let dumb egos get in the way and start wars with other poker players.

Whoa man, sure, I'll help you. You seem pretty chill- and very confident about things. Sign me up for the ppa right away!

Lmmfao (not at your misfortune- I have a lot of friends who got ****ed and I have some money on there as well- but def at everything else). I guess its time to stop talking, right?

Also lol at online pros playing live killing the live games. I'd argue more it'd get tougher because bad online regs take the spots of drunk fish but there honestly aren't that many good online regs that play 2/4+ it's just they're all on 12+ tables online a lot of the time. So like the 50 or so good American 2/4+ online regs (might be too high) I'm sure a few go overseas to play online a few go back to school, get real jobs, quit poker for whatever else, then even if the rest become live pros they get spread out around US east coast regs will play at AC some people might move to vegas some people may play at indian casinos anyway the point is I doubt any one casino gains an average of any more than like 3 good mid-high online regs and given they can only one-table and most of the big vegas rooms run several 5/10's and a few higher games run it's not going to be even noticable imo.

The biggest difference will be all the staked micro/small stakes guys who get their backers to back them for live cash and although they suck at poker like I said they'll take the place of some drunk fish at 1/2 and 2/5 games and maybe a few will play 5/10 as well and although they're not good they're not going to be bleeding money so it's going to make the game overall a bit tougher. But yeah in general I highly doubt 5/10+ games in vegas get much tougher and I'm assuming that's what the majority of people who post in this forum (whether live or online) play when they're in vegas. Maybe I'm wrong though.

I've talked to several people who said they were going to start playing at the Horseshoe in Hammond, IN. That is about to become a tough 5/10/20 game there.

I was frustrated here about what some classless people were saying. Sorry.

Maybe you should send your troops of NL10 students to the live juicy games.

I don't see how this could be bad for live games. Neutral at worst.

1. There aren't enough high stakes full ring online cash game pros in any given area to pose a threat. These are the good players. The players who are capable of patience and attention for long periods of time.

2. The majority of online pros play at lower stakes, play many tables, and use software to help them figure out how other players are playing.

3. The software that everyone uses online forces players to undertake random actions, like three betting with 64, in order to confound the other players that have an ongoing database of the hands they show down. In live games, this kind of play is useless, as even at many 10/25 live games, most players' memory of how others play hands range from very short term to completely non existent. That means online pros will three bet and four bet and bluff way too often.

4. Plop down a couple of these bluffy random type kids an a table with a couple of live pros and a few terrible regulars and the online kids are going to fire that table up. The regs will tilt off, the online kids will get pissed when some reg calls their river bluff when "he's not supposed to," or when they raise a premium hand and get called in 5 places....then they tilt off. And you have a great poker game.


It's not that online players are bad. They are just over confident and completely unprepared for the mess. They don't have tracking software, they are forced to play one table, etc.

I have already seen these kids with huge headphones and an I-pad, periodically checking pokerstars! They sit at 5/10 for a while, move to 2/5, later sit at a 10/25.....what is going on? They have no clue what to play. They're displaced.

A bunch of confused displaced inexperienced or rusty players flooding the poker room can't possibly be bad for live players.

Agreed. But when live games get tough, they die. You need a massive edge (not just a small one) to overcome the pace/variance, rake, tips and other expenses.

---

No doubt in my mind live poker got harder because of Black Friday...

lol

So many lols. A level?

bump

If (successful) online players could clone themselves and appear at 24 live tables at once, then i would have to agree that they could make live poker virtually unbeatable/ kill the game.
As is, sorry, I think their limited numbers just can't fade the sheer volume of drunk fishies, even with the economy is the pits.
Ive never had more than one or two online players of any ilk at my table at once, and i can only recall one in the last few months who I legitimately was concerned about. all the rest lacked patience/ tilted hard/ adjusted horribly/ gave str8forward live donks credit for thinking plays/ and generally donated to the game.

You're only as good as your last rodeo.

Very, very good point my good sir. You had me ROFL hard about the cloning. LAWLZ!!

You see, the reason why online guys are considered good is that they can play many table at once.

Let me throw out this crazy theory:

Is there a smidgen of a possibility that online players can't adjust to the singularity of live poker. Somehow adjusting to playing one hand at a time is harder than many thought.

Lets say you get pwned by some nub on the river. Online you don't have much time to think since you have multiple hands going at one time. If that happens in live there is much more time to think about the previous hand. This is why stampler's point about online dudes getting tilted hard is an excellent point.

Don't know if this is a level, but in my experience online players handle bad beats and errors much better than live players. You see a lot of bad beats 12 tabling and it's pretty hard not to misclick every now and then. Tilting online is way more costly than live so most good players fix that leak asap.

Ominous, to say the least. This was posted in this thread back in 2009.

I have like $1500 on full tilt and I live in the US. I haven't paid any real attention to what is going on since BF. Should I be doing anything to try and get my money out or whatever, or should I just continue doing what I have been doing (which is nothing)? Thx.

If you desperately need the 1500 you can try to sell it for like 30-40c on the dollar but assuming since you didn't pay attention it's a relatively small amount to you just wait it out and hopefully they can get investors and will be able to pay US players back.

Got it. Thx.

[QUOTE=zachvac;26137186]Also lol at online pros playing live killing the live games. I'd argue more it'd get tougher because bad online regs take the spots of drunk fish but there honestly aren't that many good online regs that play 2/4+ it's just they're all on 12+ tables online a lot of the time. So like the 50 or so good American 2/4+ online regs (might be too high) I'm sure a few go overseas to play online a few go back to school, get real jobs, quit poker for whatever else, then even if the rest become live pros they get spread out around US east coast regs will play at AC some people might move to vegas some people may play at indian casinos anyway the point is I doubt any one casino gains an average of any more than like 3 good mid-high online regs and given they can only one-table and most of the big vegas rooms run several 5/10's and a few higher games run it's not going to be even noticable imo.





My opinion on thsi i guess dont make a difference but i just thought it was amazing that you thought 50 or less really good players at 400nl etc. Before BF, there were a literal plethra of players who show bb/100 of 2-3 over large samples. Do you know how many players it takes to fill 25 tables on full tilt just at 2/4 all day long? And PTR most of them and find that most are winning players?

I dont care even if they multitable and just grind with no exceptional qualities, that alone is light years ahead of most live say 2-5 competition. The only thing keeping games alive right now is the fact that most online players are simply scattered across the globe, and not concentrated in our casino town games. If the avg. online player base all said F...it and moved to LA and Vegas and infiltrated the daily games like a herd of goats, the poker would die off in a small amt. of time. Like DG said, live games need big fish, otherwise the pace just doesnt allow for big winrates squeezed from smaller edges.

Ive seen this all before just on a tiny scale. Stardust, pot limit, 1982. When the games have 4 and 5 very competent players, then the fish get eaten faster than lightning and the game just dies. Jeeez, I already see faces that played 5-10 DAILY for years moving to 2/5 in the last year simply due to the greater amt. of time that tougher online players drop in. They are coming on on a more regular basis now and hell, they dont even try to fight them. They just move down.

Im not trying to poo poo live poker. I hope it thrives like hell forever. I just know that 2 years ago at Bellagio, 3 betting from blinds was not done by anyone other than players who were "players". Now it is common as TV commercials. Not that they play good mind you, its just that the edges are going down all the time. And with the slow ass pace of live, nobody can afford that.

Dude, there haven't been 25 games of 2/4 on FTP running simultaneously in a long, long time.