Got into an interesting turn decision in this hand and would appreciate feedback.

1/2NL

Hero ($225): Has been playing for a while at a table that has gotten increasingly active and donkish. I've been card dead and my image is pretty clean.

V1 (100$): A black woman who ran her stack up to 300+, lost it, and just rebought for a hundred. She is stacking off with any piece and keeps talking about needing to go home.

V2 (300$+): Asian guy who limps his whole range and makes tiny raises when he hits the board hard.

V3 (200$): young kid who raises a wide range, bluffs in terrible spots, and is generally spewy/bad.

V4 (200$): stationy euro guy who doesn't fold pre.


Preflop: From UTG+2 I open KTo to 7 into V1's BB. FWIW this is often a fold for me, but all of the players above were playing very badly and I wanted to get involved. My sizing is geared to discourage a reraise and to entice V1 to play with me from BB. The downside is that I'm building a pot OOP with a RIO hand. If you think that a fold is best, let me know.

The villains + 1 other player call and we see a T98 flop.

Flop (42$): V1 checks, I bet 25. V3 and V2 call, V1 calls from the BB.

Turn (142$): 5 V1 slides her stack of 70 into the pot, hero...?

Is this a fold/call/shove?

Fold pre

You get into these marginal spots oop with hands like KT and its just difficult to play.

I don't like the open. Your hand plays poorly multi-way, which it will almost certainly be, and OOP. In most games, the raise size guarantees a ton of callers, and little FE post, as they put you on a SC-type hand. Not sure of the standards in your game. Sure the V's suck, but they almost all have position on you.

Flop is problematic. It smacks the hell out of their ranges, even while giving you TPGK. I think I b/f flop and never put in another nickle if called unless our relative strength improves.

Turn is a turbo-muck with 2 players left behind, imo. Sure, you may have V1 crushed, but a lot of her range still beats you, and if you do have her crushed that leaves a lot more 2pair or flopped straight combos for Vs 2 and 3 to have.

I dont like playing at tables like this too often, so I usually would wait for a super strong hand to take them down with.

In this situation, I am also worried about players behind, so I may fold. But if your only concern is V1, then I say call. She likely has a straight or Flush draw. Maybe both. I dont see her with a set or 2 pair. Could be 1 pair and a draw as well, but could be a profitable call.

I am also in the fold pre camp. You have 4 stations to your left. You should be tightening up your raising range and playing straightforward against them. KTo is just not going to flop good enough to be worth playing. You are just going to end up in similar situations like the one you posted.

Agreed, and I realized the problem when the action went call/call/call/call/call. If KTo is a fold, are you opening KTs?

Wat? Tables like this are very profitable. Why wouldn't you like them? No offense, Huck, but it sounds like you need some serious work on your fundamentals. Why wait for a super strong hand when they are all playing marginal hands? All you need to profit is a stronger range and more positional awareness than they have. The problem in this hand is that 1) it is also marginal, and 2) it is bad to play for a small raise out of position.

As for your flop analysis, why do you say that? Obv V1 can never be the only concern unless you see other V's getting ready to muck. Also, why have you taken straight and 2-pair out of V1's range? Sets likely raise flop, though bad players often slow-play them in bad spots, but straights and turned two-pair often plays like this from bad players. Yes, the other hands in your range do as well, but I don't see why you're excluding these.

Prob not in this position. I might open-limp it if the table is limp-happy, but I'd usually just fold in UTG+2. I'd be more likely to open QTs, as you also have the one-gapper to add a lot more flopped SDs. I'd overlimp KTs all-day if someone had already limped.

Fold pre call turn

fold pre, and if u decide to open for the reasons u stated then raise bigger (~12$), u dont want to play against 5 players regardless what u have preflop..

As played, I lean more towards a fold.. I think V3 might be sitting on a monster, playing the lag image to get value later from a hand like urs..


>> u put urself in really bad spot, i dont like how the hand was playing on all streets and this usually leads to very tough decisions..

I am not saying I dont play at these tables. But I dont play often so when I do, I like to play where I can open my range more. These players you wont be able to bluff. So you have to wait for stronger hands. They will pay you off with mediocre hands and it will be highly profitable. No need to play marginal hands OOP and hope your medium strength hand is slightly better than theirs.

As for how to play it, I said fold. But I also said if you arent worried about the other players (meaning you think they fold) then call.

Virtually no one will tell you to play this hand. I am not that virtual no one.

double negative = mind cramp

Id fold pre and tighten up my range and wait for the nuts on these loose players. This is such a great table to be at unless u are card dead.

I hate ur open. I don't think it's profitable mostly bc ur oop and ur most Likely going multi way to the flop

As played I insta fold that flop hit all v's range hard and there's still two left.

Did anyone say fold pre?

I can't add much to this other than I think you're rationalizing why you played this hand pf. It had little to do with trying to isolate (there are few tables where a 3.5BB bet is going to shut down anyone calling), but much more with you being bored folding and this was the first broadway hand you had seen in a while. It is a subtle form of tilt. Frankly, I'd rather raise 72o OTB in a limped pot than KTo almost anywhere else.

I think a few people may have mentioned it This was a good thread for me to post before my session this afternoon, because it got me thinking about my opening range and what can be profitable open, esp. from early position.

So preflop is a fold. I'm cool with that. And I'm bet/folding the flop all day. But with that said, I want to avoid compounding one mistake with another: having gotten myself into this situation, what's the best play on the turn? It seems that responses are divided between a flat call and a fold.

I too loosen my play due to the softness of most tables at 1/2 and many times run in to positions like these. I'm getting better at staying TAG and not getting involved with these marginal hands, as should you.

Wow...can I sit at this table....if you have any questions about what you need to do here then you aren't any better than the spew tards at the table.

Shove!!!!!!!!!!!

Easiest fold ever. Oh yeah, and fold pre

Is she usually the one doing the betting or has she mainly been calling off her stack light? unfortunately having players to act after you makes this a fold but otherwise i'd snap this off

A mix of both. She stacked off for 150BB with top pair when it was obvious that she was beat. But she had also been doing quite a bit of betting herself both preflop and after the flop.

I really hope that this is a level, and that since you're new here you don't realize that we have a no-leveling norm, as this is a forum with lots of beginners. If this is your real response, I think you should take back your insults in the post above...

Ya..sorry was being sarcastic