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How to rediscover your play after downswing ? How to rediscover your play after downswing ?

04-01-2015 , 01:38 AM
Players go on downswing for various reasons.
In my case it was a bad beat > tilt > drinks > more tilt > -7 buyin in a session. Carries over to next sessions. More tilt. Before you know it, you are in a big downswing. You take a break from the felt. After some time, you gather yourself and come back. But now you are not your old self anymore. You are gunshy, you start doubting the actions you know at your heart are right ( which took long time for you to learn) etc... Etc... I had seen people go through this. Now I find myself in the same spot.

Any suggestions ?
How to rediscover your play after downswing ? Quote
04-01-2015 , 01:47 AM
It took me a few years to master tilt. I can confidently say today that I haven't tilted in over a year. Your outlook is the most important aspect. I do cap my losses to 4 buy-ins per session. I haven't touched that in NLHE in quite a while. PLO is another story.

Restart your play. Start with a super tight range. Then as you regain your confidence, add more speculative play
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04-01-2015 , 02:10 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by ironmikee
But now you are not your old self anymore. You are gunshy, you start doubting the actions you know at your heart are right ( which took long time for you to learn) etc... Etc... I had seen people go through this. Now I find myself in the same spot.
Use your brain, not your heart.
How to rediscover your play after downswing ? Quote
04-01-2015 , 02:15 AM
Pls explain.
And how to achieve that ? Practically.
How to rediscover your play after downswing ? Quote
04-01-2015 , 02:17 AM
Do the work.

Figure out why it is better to bet instead of check, and how much to bet.

Math, math, and more math.

Once you understand math, you wouldn't use your "heart" to figure things out.
How to rediscover your play after downswing ? Quote
04-01-2015 , 02:18 AM
whenever im doubting myself a trip to the casino for some 1/2 or 2/5 usually restores my confidence... primarily play online mtts. just seeing all the idiots in person really helps
How to rediscover your play after downswing ? Quote
04-01-2015 , 02:44 AM
+1
Only problem is mine's 2hrs away.
How to rediscover your play after downswing ? Quote
04-01-2015 , 03:23 AM
Read a book.
How to rediscover your play after downswing ? Quote
04-01-2015 , 03:30 AM
Name ???
How to rediscover your play after downswing ? Quote
04-01-2015 , 03:42 AM
The best of llsnl
That little sticky thread up there
Work your way through every single thread in there and don't go back to the tables until you have
Judging by the three hands you posted in the other thread, you're leaking not tilting
How to rediscover your play after downswing ? Quote
04-01-2015 , 03:46 AM
I don't think you can beat the game if your tilt is that bad. 7 buy-ins in a session from drinks and tilt? And it carries over into future sessions?

What happens when you lose 7 buy-ins because of bad cards instead of tilt? I would expect you to tilt even more and lose a huge amount.
How to rediscover your play after downswing ? Quote
04-01-2015 , 03:59 AM
I used to have those tilts a lot few years ago. I have taken poker seriously in last six months. Had episodes like that twice in last six months. After first one, I spent a lot of time studying and analyzing. Developed a solid TAG game. Then the second episodes happened ( I seem to bring outside baggage into my poker game). Was playing like drunken maniac you usually see 2 in the morning whole night. May be I should go to the last remedy that worked. Study again. Harder.
How to rediscover your play after downswing ? Quote
04-01-2015 , 04:07 AM
Post hands on 2 + 2 and rely on your brain during a hand. The biggest danger in tilting is making mistakes, but not realizing that they're mistakes.

I have a friend who's been on a big downswing recently. He normally plays a decent, but not great game. Recently, he's been making mistakes because of his luck.

For example, he knows that his opponent is on a flush draw and he knows he's well ahead in the hand; but he won't bet the turn because he "knows" villain is going to hit his flush on the river.

It's human nature to start expecting bad outcomes when you're running bad. It's one thing to "know" villain is going to suck out. It's another to make a poker mistake because of it. Just make the right plays and let the cards fall where they may.

When I'm in a downswing, I tend to not rely on my instincts as much. I just try to analyze situations as if I were playing online.
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04-01-2015 , 04:10 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve00007

What happens when you lose 7 buy-ins because of bad cards instead of tilt? I would expect you to tilt even more and lose a huge amount.

I usually try to avoid RIO and slight edge (55/45) situations. I don't feel it's always necessary at 1/2. There are better spots. When I m playing calm and relaxed, I can take bad beats pretty easily. I have lost a couple of 350BB pots going in as 80/20 favorite quite recently and rebounded pretty nicely on the same sessions to end up in profit. I have described the problem I m facing now in another post, "jitter or bank roll issue".
How to rediscover your play after downswing ? Quote
04-01-2015 , 07:13 AM
Winning poker isn't for everyone. Your responses to the suggestions people are giving you indicate it probably isn't for you, either. It is simple in theory, difficult in practice: Don't play when tilting, don't bring your outside problems to the table and make the maximum +EV decisions despite what your emotions are telling you.

There's no one book you're going to read to turn it around. You have to change yourself. That takes tremendous discipline and time. Whether it is Angelo or Tendler, you're going to spend a lot of time working on your mental game. It isn't going to end with you cured after a reading. It is going to be a lifetime of practicing and failing at times.

Good luck. You'll need it.
How to rediscover your play after downswing ? Quote
04-01-2015 , 08:03 AM
Downswing's are an illusion. You are either playing well or not.
Seems you've gone trough this before and come out ahead.

"I have taken poker seriously in last six months. Had episodes like that twice in last six months. After first one, I spent a lot of time studying and analyzing. Developed a solid TAG game. Then the second episodes happened ( I seem to bring outside baggage into my poker game). Was playing like drunken maniac you usually see 2 in the morning whole night. May be I should go to the last remedy that worked. Study again. Harder."

GL.
How to rediscover your play after downswing ? Quote
04-01-2015 , 08:22 AM
I used to do this too. Just be honest with yourself about the CAUSE for the downswing. I'll bet 1.5 of my lungs that you played "chase-y" trying to recoup losses in hands you had no business playing.

"Hmm a raise to $7 from up front, 3 callers, and it's to me in the HJ seat with 97suited. I'm only 100BB's deep, but I'm getting at least 4 to 1....call"

"I'm UTG+2, I have AJsuited. Best hand I've seen in an hour. Raise. **** three callers. QJ5 one of my suite. Make a c-bet, **** two callers. Turn 8h. Well now I have an overcard, a pair, and the NFD. Check/raise all-in. Get shown T9. Reload"

"KK, finally a monster. I'm not gonna re-raise this guy, I'll play slow and go for a big pot. Flop T93, perfect. He bets, I'll just call. Turn Ace, brings a flush draw. Villain pauses, looks at his chips and checks. He might have caught that ace, better try and get to a cheap showdown, check. River is an 8 that completes the backdoor flush draw. Now villain leads for 3/4 pot"

^Do any of those sound familiar? Are you limping more hands than you usually would thinking "it's just one BB, I'm suited, multi-way, maybe I'll make something"

If you want to "recalibrate" your game, then take a session and just fold, fold, fold, fold, fold, fold, fold, fold, fold, and to mix it up, fold some more.

It's like when baseball players warm up with a heavier bat. By folding so very much 1) you'll lose a lot less. 2) At LLSNL players are still dumb enough to call you sometimes, so you'll probably still make money playing a very exploitable "premiums only" strategy.

Do that for four hours, and then come back teh next day and see how you feel.

A long time ago I fell victim to some of the same thinking I've described. I had a few >5 buy-in downswings in a night. One thing I did try, but not sure I would recommend it to everyone, is to go play a tournament. Just try and fold your way to the money. Don't get too fancy trying to out play everyone.
How to rediscover your play after downswing ? Quote
04-01-2015 , 08:54 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by ironmikee
Players go on downswing for various reasons.
In my case it was a bad beat > tilt > drinks > more tilt > -7 buyin in a session. Carries over to next sessions. More tilt. Before you know it, you are in a big downswing. You take a break from the felt. After some time, you gather yourself and come back. But now you are not your old self anymore. You are gunshy, you start doubting the actions you know at your heart are right ( which took long time for you to learn) etc... Etc... I had seen people go through this. Now I find myself in the same spot.

Any suggestions ?
I would recommend to read The Mental Game of Poker 1 (& later 2).
How to rediscover your play after downswing ? Quote
04-01-2015 , 09:03 AM
Strip your game down to "raise or fold" until you feel comfortable again. Ie, don't call (unless it's calling an AI), only enter a pot by raising. If that means 3betting, then either 3bet or fold.

It may work for you, it may not, but if you've been to limp or call happy then it might help
How to rediscover your play after downswing ? Quote
04-01-2015 , 12:26 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by venice10
Winning poker isn't for everyone. Your responses to the suggestions people are giving you indicate it probably isn't for you, either. It is simple in theory, difficult in practice: Don't play when tilting, don't bring your outside problems to the table and make the maximum +EV decisions despite what your emotions are telling you.

There's no one book you're going to read to turn it around. You have to change yourself. That takes tremendous discipline and time. Whether it is Angelo or Tendler, you're going to spend a lot of time working on your mental game. It isn't going to end with you cured after a reading. It is going to be a lifetime of practicing and failing at times.

Good luck. You'll need it.
Truth hurts.
How to rediscover your play after downswing ? Quote
04-01-2015 , 12:50 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard Parker
Truth hurts.
Such insight!
How to rediscover your play after downswing ? Quote
04-01-2015 , 12:59 PM
It sounds a bit like you need to get the rest of your life together before you worry about poker. I never tilt if I'm playing gambly drunk just to have fun, because I realize that's what I'm doing. If you are bringing outside life to the table, you need to not play until the outs life life is taken care of. Or, play very, very tight, concentrating, with no alcohol. Also, always set a "leave the table" time, whether it's a certain time or certain bankroll (wins or losses) -- and stick to it!
How to rediscover your play after downswing ? Quote
04-01-2015 , 03:12 PM
I used to have tilt issues when I was younger. It's like wringing out a towel, different amounts of liquid for different people. The only solution for me was to quit for long awhile, pay off debt and get my personal finances to the point where I simply don't care about the money for the stakes I play. Makes the game exponentially easier. Then studytime/trying hard to beat it. Not the other way around.
How to rediscover your play after downswing ? Quote
04-01-2015 , 03:49 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by ShermanTank
I used to have tilt issues when I was younger. It's like wringing out a towel, different amounts of liquid for different people. The only solution for me was to quit for long awhile, pay off debt and get my personal finances to the point where I simply don't care about the money for the stakes I play. Makes the game exponentially easier. Then studytime/trying hard to beat it. Not the other way around.
This X100

I started playing much better after I paid off my student loans, invested a little, and realized I COULD afford to lose.
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