My friend asked me today if I was interested in staking him for 100NL and sent me a proposal. All my staking experience is in MTT's so I was wondering if a couple of you guys who have more experience (on either end) of a cash game staking arrangement wouldn't mind taking a look.

My take:

1) I know my friend is a winning 100NL player (I have played with him a good deal in person and I have seen his online graphs). He doesn't have a huge winrate, but he plays a fairly conservative, low variance style and he never tilts.

2) I know my friend is trustworthy and it does not seem like a big investment.

His proposal:

I am looking for a backer that would provide a $2000 investment so that I can be properly bankrolled to play 100nl. The backer would realize 50% of all gains made in my account (bonuses and otherwise) and would assume 100% of the losses to my account (up to the initial investment).

Muk's note - how would we keep track of bonuses?

Details:
• I would be playing only full ring at the specified stake
• Average volume: 2-4 sessions of 500-1000 hands total over 12 tables per week for an approximate total of 2000 hands per week.
• I will provide the backer with a daily account balance by noon every day
• The backer will be allowed to log in to my account at any time requested within 24 hours notice (I will provide temporary password)
• The stake may be terminated at any time by either the backer or myself, without notice
• The backer may “cash out” his profits at any time or leave them on account

Termination:
Upon termination of the stake, the “account balance” will be the most recent “daily balance” of the account. This means that if the stake is terminated mid-day on Wednesday, the account balance used to settle will be the Tuesday final balance. Myself or the backer can determine when to end the stake at any time. I would be looking to terminate the stake once realizing approximately $1000 in gains, this, however, can be negotiated.

winning players dont need to be backed...

he doesn't have any $ on Stars and doesn't want to move funds over from other sites

also the main idea of staking is sacrificing some of your winnings to eliminate variance, i.e. no risk investment

I would never look for staking for cash games but I can see the rationale

i'm getting his PT stats shortly, will post here.

this has always been my theory in regards to this situation.

good luck.

my counterproposal:

I send 3k to play 200NL

He plays 9 tables maximum with a minimum of 10k hands/mo (avg 2500 hands/wk). If this volume is not reached for any month (without extenuating circumstances) the stake is ended and all funds must be returned.

He keeps all bonuses but i get 60% of any winnings as a Stars transfer once a week, along with an e-mail with PT screen shots.

lol muck if u wanna do this to help the guy thats fine but thats the only way I can reason it being a logically sound decision.

If ur actually sure this guy is a winning player, you should make him play under the stake until he makes at least like 5k to make it worth ur time as u will probably be coaching him a little here and there as well. Him being able to quit after making only 1k is pretty weak.

Basacally u should be able to quit the staking agreement anytime u want, but he can only quit until after hes made u 5k.

I don't think u should put in a hand per week/month thing though as I think he should not be forced to play a certain amount each week/month though as long as hes playing a decent amount.

you should definitely not allow him to back out on a whim

if you do that then he totally freerolls you and can just quit whenever variance has swung a decent amount in either direction

the stake is only +EV for you if there will be a guaranteed sample size where he is very likely to be ahead. Do not make a deal where he has no incentive to play well (or play at all) if he's stuck.

I would also make sure to find out exactly why a winning player doesn't have a bankroll for the game. If he has money but it's simply not liquid (but he *could* access it if needed) then you might want to consider just loaning him money at a certain interest rate. This would probably lower your EV in the deal but it would put the variance back on his side and also greatly reduce the amount of work and potential problems for you.

Kinda feels like the vultures are starting to circle here. Usually staking tends to work out better when someone asks to stake a person. The other thing you have to think about is how good of friends are you? If he loses due to breaking some of the rules, or just goes on monkey tilt and loses the stake, are you going to be ok with that? Will it affect your friendship? I dunno, I guess what i am trying to say is that there are more factors involved in this then just poker that have to be considered when deciding if this is +ev for you.

Ive made soah over 10k so far from his staking investments in me. In general Id say you are right though.

winning players dont need to be backed once they have built up their bankrolls, i remember when i first started out, knowing i could beat 400NL+ but just not having the bankroll to do it i wasted months of my time grinding low limits getting enough cash to play these games if i had of had someone backing me i would have earnt more during the time than grinding it at the baby stakes.
if he's a mate and u wanna help him and its not that much cash to you then give it a shot but dpon't expect it to be + ev. and no way he can back ut after 1k profit that is so unfair on you its not even funny i agree 5k profit is more reasonable.

I decided to pass on the deal.

Thanks to everyone who took the time to give feedback

It took you months to get enough money for 400nl? I'm sure you wouldn't have beat 400 nl if you woulda just jumped in with a backer. The fact it took you months at lower stakes might have given you the experience/skills needed to move up. I bet if ya went back to those stakes now you could make enough for 400nl in a couple weeks.

yes also.. do not back him.. he's not a winning player. Winning cash game players especially don't need to be backed. I can kinda see why a tourny player would be but not a cass game player.

Good fold, OP. You would have had more to lose and less to gain w/ that deal.

What does your friend do with his life that he essentially wants to play 100NL for a living, while giving away HALF of what he wins?