1/3 NL
Villain is on the button and straddles for $10. It folds to me in middle position and I limp with KTdd. It folds to the villain who makes it $30. I call.

Flop comes Qd8d4d. I check and villain bets $55. I call.

Turn comes 9d. I check, villain bets $100. I call. I have maybe $330 behind at this point and villain has me covered.

River is a brick (2c). I check, villain shoves. I tank for a while and eventually let it go. Villain is a spew-y albeit very capable player. Definitely capable of bluffing in that spot, I just couldn’t call off my whole stack when it’s so easy for him to just have the ace.

I regret not check shoving on the flop and putting him in a tougher spot if he had something like AQ with the ace of diamonds. Otherwise I’m not sure how differently I could’ve played it. Just one of those sick spots.

raise pre
c/r flop but calling sometimes is good too. did you say you wanted to check shove the flop? No you dont want to do that
river you really should be calling but vs the avg live guy you can probably fold and feel kind of ok about it

Raise pre. BTN straddle raise could be anything and you didnt give us any image reads on V but BTN straddlers are almost always super loose players. He could have Ad2x here.

How do you not call that river when you are against a spewy straddled button villain? You limping in middle position and not getting aggro on that flop/turn = he knows you never have an Ad.

More so, when you call the turn, apart from the Ad showing up, what relevent river are you hoping to see that would have made you call a 2nd bullet? If you do think he has it, I would fold turn. There are very few cards he probably isn't firing a 2nd bullet on when he fires on the 4th diamond turn.

I’m calling this river.

I raise PF, tho. 2,5bb shall be enough.
Now we have the lead on the hand and it’s alot easier to play that way.

As played call down. I’m not raising flop. We have position so let him bluff this scary board and if he checks, we bet.

Raise or fold pf the first go around. Don't call. After it is raised, then fold. You have a RIO hand. Don't call with RIO hands after a raise.

As played, you're hoping at best that he has a Jx hand. Is he really raising pf with J7? Because that's the best hand he can have that you beat by the turn. I'd probably call the flop in case he's drawing, but it got there on the turn. Easy fold.

I mostly fold preflop initially to begin with, but especially with a Button straddler involved where we will never end up with position. I also fold to the raise; I highly doubt playing OOP with speculative hands versus a preflop raiser is going to be profitable unless our opponent is really bad.

SPR is 8 on the flop. With position, we could guarantee a bet going in on every street for stacks (which is what we want with this flop). But OOP it is so much more difficult as a capable villain could check behind (or a spewy villain might spew). Against spewy villains who could barrel air I don't mind a check/call line on early streets and then decide whether I should shove the river myself. Against others perhaps a betx3 line is best.

Turn is obviously gross. I think I would mostly give up and exit here if he's betting, because this bet carries the risk of facing another one for stacks on the river (which is what happened). But if we think he's spewy, I guess we could call down.

But really just need to fold preflop, imo.

GcluelessNLnoobG

You're holding the 2nd and 4th nuts in your hand, that's a problem.

You have to call. Sometimes you lose. Suppose he had your hand, he sounds like he would have played it the same way. You made the mistake I have made many times, you assigned him the only card that could beat you. What if he had TJhh.

You had a made hand and kept giving him free cards. Bet the flop to give him bad odds to keep drawing. Honest advice, you played scared he had a better flush or the Ad if he called your raise. Rethink why you played the flop so passive. If you raised the flop, non of this happens. If you c/r the flop the hand is over.

If you don't feel comfortable raising to a size that makes the straddler want to fold, then you should fold yourself.

Like yes it sucks that you might have to make it 45 to realistically play this hand, but the 10 straddle makes this hand play big.

No you don't have to call. Suppose he had our hand? What?

My guess OP was check/calling the flop to let a spewy guy spew on blank runouts, not because he was scurred.

And is our goal to check/raise the flop with the second nuts to end the hand?

I'm not saying putting more money in on the flop is a bad thing, but I'm not a fan of your reasons.

GcluelessNLnoobG

This. I fold KT suited in this spot. So many times the straddler is going to raise (especially button straddles), so I don't want to play this hand OOP in a bloated pot.

As played, I am not sure why you didn't raise the flop. On the river, V is either bluffing or has the Ad. It's pretty much nothing else. You're getting a little better than 2-1 pot odds. Is V bluffing more than 30% of the time here? In my experience, most 1-3 players are not bluffing this board with this action more than 30%.

I think you have to make the painful fold.

$330 to win $700. If he's called this far which l said is wrong, don't pass up 2-1 now.

He has been call, call why? Because V has what? Now, a scare card comes on the river and villain shoves. Why the overbet? It's not for value and I bet hero tells you V was relieved he didn't call. Classic bluffing spot. The way hero played the hand is a perfect trap. V sees he's weak. Obviously would have bet the A-high flush? Shove. 50/50 play.

First, you are asking the wrong question. Your question should be how should I play my flopped flush? You need to figure out how to play this hand from the flop. You can't ask, if l make this error, then l make this error, should I make a hard fold. What you want to learn is how to avoid getting is this spot. Call the river, lose all you money or win a huge pot. Still, go back over the hand and examine what happened. Sometimes you can win a big pot and still play bad.

You don't want to play k10 suited in middle position in a straddled pot?

OP: When you called the turn, what was your plan for the river?

Fold pre.

$20 more and he could already have your K10 crushed. Snap fold river.

Tbh, I didn't really have one. Like I said, if I could play the hand over again, I'd check shove the flop. And I agree with everyone saying I should be raising pre-flop. It solidifies the range of a spew-y player in a naturally wide spot, so there's no reason I should be limping there.

I suppose I could say I was hoping to see the Ad on the river. I also had a redraw to the straight flush, and this is ultimately what got me to call on the turn. But yeah, main thoughts in the first paragraph.

Raise pre. As played check-raise flop. From the turn onwards just make a reasonable assessment of range based on this particular player and call/fold based on whether bluff frequency > 1/3 and this may be a call or fold - blanket statements from forum on snap folding v unknown V irritate me.

[QUOTE=dpluswhy;5517097Villain is a spew-y albeit very capable player. Definitely capable of bluffing in that spot, I just couldn’t call off my whole stack when it’s so easy for him to just have the ace.

[/QUOTE]


If this is truly your read, then it’s a fistpump snap call.




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Doesn’t the Clarkmeister Theorem apply here?

Protection bet river with second nut! Your check river is the blunder here.


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c/r flop or maybe even lead, even spewy players aren't going to cbet this board particularly often. AP I am making the painful fold since his big flop bet and three barrel range is ridiculously Ad heavy.

Sure, if you know the opponent has the Ad then check-shove makes sense, but we don't know that yet. Check shove flop is lazy.

Flop is a good time to pull out the ole' min-raise technique or close to min-raise.

If we flopped a lower flush we could do a 3-4x raise since there are more flush draw hands we want to charge that could beat us.

Opponent, even LAG, is not stabbing this board without a piece of it and should be rarely folding to a min raise. You can go to b/f town and be able to play this hand much easier and higher EV.

You want to fold against a guy who has 10$ in front of him and could literally have any two cards in the deck?

I realize I ***** about this a lot, but we are past OMC levels of nit here. Your hand is crushing a $10 button straddle range.

@OP: It makes sense. I guess the point I was making is you have to decide at the turn if he has the Ace or not. These guys might disagree with it, but whether he has it or not, he is firing two bullets into this pot when you check back the turn. If you are calling the turn, be prepare to call his river on most blanks.