$1/3, 7 handed, game is playing big and most players are loose and aggressive.
Hero in the straddle with T6os on a $1500 stack. Ran stack up from $300 max quickly by value betting nutty hands and winning a 3 way all in with a flush.
V1 in LP sitting on $850 - heÂ’s late 50s, one of the better players in the room, aggressive, loose, non-believer. Plays 2/5 when it runs on the weekends.
V2 in the big blind with $1200. Late 20s, silly mustache. Takes a long time on all decisions. Tank shoved AK on A53 rainbow after 3 betting pre when a guy with a big stack led with QQ and somehow called it off. V2 also folded AK on 3558 after 3 betting pre and leading otf.

UTG opens to $21, folds to V1 who calls, SB calls, V2 in BB calls and hero feels like he canÂ’t fold his straddle for $15 more in this spot also makes the call. Pot is roughly $100.

Flop is 662sxs

V2 leads for $50, Hero makes it $150, folds to V1 who shoves for $850, folds to V2 who tank shoves for $1200. After the flop action there is about $2300 in the pot and itÂ’s $1000 to call.

Hero?

Seems like a tough spot. ItÂ’s hard for me to put either player on less than 6x. I donÂ’t see either guy shoving with an overpair and if they had a strong overpair they likely raise pre. I range V1 on 22, 6x, maybe NFDs and straight flush draws. I really think that V2 has only 22 and 6x in his range.

I'm folding pre without a thought, it's not a multiway hand or even close to one that you don't mind calling when you get priced in.

As played I would fold, I'm not going broke here with a med kicker and A6s in everyone's range pretty much.

If I've seen it once I've seen it a thousand times when posters post hands they "shoulda" folded pre only to get themselves into these kinds of situations.

That for sure is an ugly spot. I highly doubt that both players will show up with better than 6x here since that would require them to have precisely 22 and the last 6. So most likely one of them is out of line with a semi-bluff/draw type of hand (or slowplayed aces or some random crap), and the other one has 6x or 22. Not sure how their ranges look preflop - you beat most "reasonable" 6x hands (86/76/65/64) and lose to like A6, however judging from the table decription, one of them could just as easily have J6 or 62. And it's 1000 to call to win a 4300 pot, so you are getting good odds.

Another aspect to factor in is the rebuy factor. If you lose, are you comfortable with and able to reload with let´s say 2000 USD, or are you forced to buy in for like 300 or so? I wouldn´t want to place a big stack at risk in a marginal spot in a wild deep-stacked game if I can´t rebuy to cover most of the other players if I lose.

I think you beat more 6x than you lose to A6/22. Since the table is loose aggressive the other player (most likely V2) can have a draw. I haven’t looked at the spot in pokercruncher/equilab but my intuition is you have the odds to call.

But yeah fold pre, for sure. The fact you called exposes a big leak in your preflop game.

Max buy in is unfortunately $300

Probably from V2 in the BB, not sure about V1 who was the first caller.

Against 6x we're beating right now, we also have to factor in a roughly 25% split pot chance because our T isn't playing anymore on the river.

The call pre is really bad. Would you also call that hand from the BB if the raise was to $13 and you had to put in $10 more?

I 100% agree that preflop is a huge mistake. Just fold garbage will make life a lot easier. This hand is a perfect example of getting a dream flop and still being in trouble.

I rarely play deep in my 1/3 NL game, so my worthless 2 cents...

I fold preflop. Yeah, we're getting ok immediate odds. But we're going to be OOP with an absolute trash hand postflop.

If we flat the donk is there an ok chance someone goes nutso behind us? If so, I don't mind flatting the donk. SPR is also a non-short 12 against V2; are we comfortable stacking off on that SPR? The more comfortable we are stacking off the more raising is fine, otherwise might be meh...

I would typically fold to this action in my game, but these are *massive* bets in my game. It's very unlikely V2 would shove with 22 or draws, but he could easily play 6x this way (although I guess it is kinda close as to how many better versus worse 6x he could show up with). I guess V1 could be pushing something like overs + flush draw and perhaps better/worse 6x. Pretty tough spot, imo.

GcluelessNLnoobG

I think I’d fold it pre also in the latter scenario. It’s close to a 4x raise in either case. Possibly call T6s but an argument could be made to fold that as well.

It could very well be a fold OTF. I was assuming the game is loose and 86/76/65 offsuit are all in play. If V1 only has suited 6x combos we aren’t doing as well.

I think I said something wrong before that V2 most likely has a draw. It looks like V2 is more weighted towards 6x and never a draw given the action here. I think a draw would fold OTF rather than tank call. Possibly V1 has a draw, but even that seems unlikely, since he’s shoving into two players showing strength.

My bad, the question about pre was meant for OP to illustrate how bad the call is

But that's a pretty important point: Even better players massively overcall from the UTG straddle with hands they would auto-fold from the BB.

I agree with you that the decision in this hand is highly dependent on how many smaller offsuited 6x hands villains have in their range. If we think they call pre with 64-68o I don't think we can fold here.

Honestly dude, fold pre. I get it, you're getting a good price and you want to defend your straddle, but tbh you're just going to find yourself in a lot of these tough spots even if you flop well, which, in the vast majority of cases, you won't with hands like these. When you play marginal hands, due to pot odds or whatever other reason, you have a really high chance of reverse implied odds and can easily end up value owning yourself. Fold pre and save yourself $15 and the headache.

My buddy was in a similar spot a couple years back he had 64 of clubs. everyone was more than 200bb deep and the action pre flop was crazy (the main villain was a true spew donkey calling station of a fish. this main villain was getting way out of line pre flop and post flop and getting massively lucky). the flop came like 66Jr. the action went crazy with 3 guys going all in (including the main villian) and it gets to my friend. some would say this is an easy call, but multi way and deep you have to start to consider every possibility. My friend ended up calling and was good but it took him a minute to call. If I was in this spot in the last 1/3 nlhe in for 300 and the chance to win 3300 I would be calling nearly every time but its opening yourself up to varience. The thing is you have to just play for pure value in 1/3 and even in some 2/5s.

Fold pre, these hands will teach you that. I think I might just flat on the flop instead of raising, if you get other callers and there’s no spade then I’ll have some leads if OOP player checks. AP your hand looks exactly like what it is, and you got 2 massive stacks behind you to just jam. I think normal 6x should be worried by your raise, 22 can think of flatting sometimes with other players in the hand but you have to be worried about it. Only one of them can have a 6, is V2 really shoving 1200$ in on a draw with paired board and action preceding? I don’t think so, his 6x is probably A6 suited and he can have 22.

I think you are beat, maybe the price is good enough but you are drawing to 3 outs a fair amount of the time and the dream would be that you are against some sort of weak 6x and a big draw in which case you probably have around 55%? 12% for the worse kicker and around 33% for the big draw I’d think. Rest of the time ur the 12%.

Grunch

Pre-pre-flop, I learned a while ago that questioning OP straddling is like criticizing their religious beliefs so all I'm going to say is that I'm an atheist and leave it at that.

Pre-flop, if suited sure complete with these odds but just dump the offsuit trash. Best case scenario is ending up in weird spots with bottom two pair or trips and crap kicker.

Flop early, I'm not for a raise when it's a way ahead way behind scenario. Only the spade draw out there to charge really, very little in the way of worse value.

Flop later just fold. V2 has tons of better 6X in his BB complete range, has 22. He led into the field on the flop, then shoved after someone else cold shoved. They both can't have 54ss.

Sent from my Pixel 6 Pro using Tapatalk

LOL snap fold this dogchit preflop. I probably call with $6 in front and $3 to call and if I'm super tilted I probably call for $6 but $15 nope.

I let this go OTF.

Then I´d fold, unless the game is about to break soon and I´m looking for a gamble to go big or go home.

I´d say that you probably are good a large enough of the time to warrant a call given the pot odds and game/table decription, however it is an extreme variance spot for big money, so folding isn´t bad either. If the game is not about to break soon then the max rebuy of 300 is a big factor, if you fold you still have a 1300 USD stack and a chance of getting it in later with higher equity, if you call and lose you´re down to 300 and, well, sitting shortstacked in a deep game is never fun and limits your profitability.

Murphy´s Law is probably in action here - when you fold the villains will show up with something like A4 w/flushdraw and 65 or something like that, when you call you´ll be in bad shape against A6 or 22 or something

I ran the spot in pokercruncher and it looks like a breakeven call.

Gave one villain 3 combos of NFDs (A2s-A5s), A6,86-46,22

Gave the other villain A6,86-46,22

Your equity versus those ranges is around 26%

You need like 26% equity from the pot odds.

So it’s a 0EV call.

If you throw in some spaz with overpairs or more flush draws it becomes a +EV call.

So it basically boils down to game dynamics in a live game, since losing and being left with a little over 300 in such a game probably is massively -EV. On the other hand, these types of stacks and this type of play (at least in my experience) often occurs late in the night/early in the morning, when players are stuck and gambling to get even, drunk and not giving a **** or just tired and looking to bust or make a big score. If that is the case there is a quite large chance of the game breaking, for example, the one winning the pot might be tempted to quit and book a big win, while the loser might be tempted to just call it a night, and that is a case for calling. Only the OP knows the circumstances of the game at the time and therefore what would be a better action.

If the game was to run at a similar pace for at least a few hours more, I´d rather fold and try to find a better spot, if the game was expected to end quite soon I´d call.

Great points ReGen