Had an interesting pot come up last night and since the vast majority of SSNL poker players are really uncomfortable and fit/fold in huge pots (200+ BB), I thought it would be fun to post. Table was friendly and soft so have all 3 of the major hands, although I wasn't personally involved. These are my reads however, and I thought it may be interesting to see what people would do in multiple heros' spots. So without further ado, choose your champion!


NcDaddy (BB - $700) - MAWG with 4 grown kids, up in DC/MD from NC with a group of friends to play poker. Understands the game and poker entertainment (was talking about Hellmuth's stud final table blowup earlier and watches Negreanu's streams), but is a bit nitty in big pots and misses out on a lot of value. Has frequently lamented folding big hands. That said, I suspect that he's also situationally aware of table dynamics and has bet to steal when checked to on turns.

Proud Capitalist (UTG/S - $550) - Also a MAWG who was late to the game on birth control and one of Nc-Daddy's buddies from NC, in a capitalism t-shirt in the style of the Coca-Cola lable. Also understands the game and isn't a fish, but is a bit loose-passive. Sat down with a stack of blacks and greens and refused my offer to change them up because "then he'd be tempted to bet them." Was a bit triggered folding to my aggression on a double barrel earlier. I don't think he really studies the game but thinks about it more than the average 1/3 villain. Clearly has gotten a bit bored and is looking to gamble since it's after midnight. Him and I thought a PLO bomb pot would be fun but were shut down by the floor, and then suggested a round of straddles. This was the first hand of said straddles.

NYSAG (Nice Young South Asian Guy, BTN - $400) - Started the game at about $350 or so, went down to about $150 and has clawed his way back. Seems to fashion himself a TAG but is splashing around in too many pots and usually plays pretty passively, although he has had bouts of aggression. Doesn't seem to read board textures well. Clearly thinks about the game a lot but is giving tons of information away for free... turns over his hand pretty much every time a pot doesn't get to showdown and explains his reasoning (e.g needed to make it look like a value bet). Admitted that he would fold TP to a 2nd or 3rd bet multiple times, which had me licking my chops looking for a good opportunity to barrel. Has a tendency to get aggressive when shown weakness in reasonable pots, has generally defended his straddles pretty aggressively about 40% of the time.

Preflop:

NcDaddy ($700) in the BB with TT
Capitalist ($550) in the straddle with KJ
NYSAG ($400) OTB with 66

1 limper, NYSAG raises to $20, SB folds NcDaddy calls in BB and Capitalist raises UTG/S to $75. Limper folds, NYSAG calls, NcDaddy calls.

Flop ($225 after rake):

3 9 3

What is your plan?

NcDaddy should have been the one to 3bet. Shame on him.

I guess NcDaddy should bet, but I doubt he will since he doesn't have any idea what's going on. Once NcDaddy chickens out, Capitalist should absolutely c-bet, then NYSAG should fold and NcDaddy can re-raise or fold, although he'll most likely just call.

Edit: if NcDaddy does bet, Capitalist should raise or fold. NYSAG should fold. Capitalist will probably just flat w/ his overs and hit a K on the turn, though

FWIW, NYSAG should have folded to the 3bet (or gotten cheeky and 4bet), and NcDaddy should have 4bet or folded.

Preflop is a mistake for NYSAG and NoDaddy after the raise to $75. If they think Capitalist is bluffing they should shove preflop. NYSAG probably has to fold, he is squeezed and his hand is too weak for the situation. A shove from NoDaddy makes sense though. NoDaddy making a 3 bet in the first place would probably have been better.

On the flop NoDaddy has the option of checking or betting. The flop likely missed opponents so a bet is reasonable but he could also wait for Capitalist to c-bet. Capitalist is in a bad situation. He has two opponents, whiffed the flop entirely but he showed all the aggression preflop. A c-bet is reasonable but checking and giving up is fine also.

NYSAG is in a tough situation, the flop likely missed everybody but he only has a weak pair and if there is any action he is likely beat after the strong preflop action. Villains don't know that yet though. So a bet seems reasonable if it is checked to him, the problem is that his stack is so short compared to pot. This is where reading opponents really matters. If a bet will be taken as strong by opponents because he is committing so much of his stack then a bet is OK. If villains will just go ahead and move in with anything reasonable because his stack is small then he has to give up. What NYSAG doesn't know is that NoDaddy has a hand he should never be folding in this situation.

There are more options here then you might expect. The combination of preflop mistakes and the order of action open up more reasonable options then would be normal, particularly given the low SPR.

The flop action likely fits one of these cases:
NoDaddy bets and everybody else folds.
Capitalist bets, NYSAG folds, NoDaddy calls or raises all in.
NYSAG bets, NoDaddy calls, Capitalist folds.
Pot checks around.

Capitalist is my champion so far because he's played the hand better than the other two, but I'll be really sad if NcDaddy checks and Capitalist doesn't c-bet.

NYSAG:

I'm never going to hate too much on a Button raise after just one limper and some dead straddle money. But if anyone is 3betty then getting raised really sucks because we really should be folding at our stack size, and thus have to forfeit our raising chips, our setmining equity, and our position, which is a disaster when that happens. So I would lean to overlimping at active tables (so that I can call a raise), and I fold to the 3bet (not getting setmining odds and I'm not convinced our position is going to enable us to play this hand too great on the vast majority of flops).

I fold to any flop bet and probably lean to a small bet if it is checked to me (with that likely being the last money I put in the pot).


NcDaddy:

I'm actually fine with the preflop flat with no real huge dead money in the pot. If the straddler and limper calls we have an awesome ~setmining spot. Otherwise we play some poker.

Depending on how active the 3better is and how passive the Button is, I might consider just ripping it in preflop with this hugenormous dead money in the pot (one of the benefits of passively being the first flatter with a biggish hand). Our call ain't tremendous (although it is better than Button's due to closing the action, knowing we're going 3way, and our effective stack being better for ~setmining).

I probably check/evaluate the flop.


Capitalist:

I just fold preflop and think this hand is too weak (and possibly horribly dominated) to 3bet preflop (especially OOP).

As played, I probably cbet $100ish which should get a lot of better hands (Ax, KQ, and possibly even nitty small pairs) to fold. Probably done with it if I get called unless a good barrel card (i.e. A) comes on the turn.

GcluelessNLnoobG

Ask and you shall receive!

Flop ($225 after rake): 3 9 3

NcDaddy checks - Capitalist c-bets $125

What would you do in NYSAG and NcDaddy's spots? Call? Raise? Fold?

Hands/stacks (at start) for reference:

NcDaddy ($700) - BB with TT
Capitalist ($550) - UTG/S with KJ
NYSAG ($400) - OTB with 66

NYSAG should fold (he should have already), as should NcDaddy. NcDaddy totally screwed up (easy to say when you know the hands, but not 3betting the first time was terrible).

Capitalist wins!

NYSAG really has to fold. An all in bluff isn't going to work against any made hand and is far too risky against two opponents.

NcDaddy should shove. He has an over pair and Capitalist doesn't have much left. His hand isn't high enough to risk over cards so flatting would be bad. Folding is too weak with an over pair when SPR was 2 on the flop.

NYSAG - open is fine, but his stack depth suggests he should be either 4bet or folding so don't like the call of the 3bet. If he's calling pre I just don't know how he can't play back at this flop (short of soul reading NC for having a higher pp) so I wanna say he should be shoving here to deny equity but tbh he really shouldn't be in this spot at all. I'm not big on the "Don't be there" Mr. Miyagi defense when it comes to poker but I think it really applies here. NYSAG really, really, really shouldn't be there.

NC - Not 3betting a button open with TT is straight up profane. After the obvious squeeze squizzles there's now $175 dead in the middle which is more than a quarter of his stack, so shoving over the top might be even more of a slam dunk than the original 3bet spot. My guy absolutely butchered pre. On this flop he's near the top of his range and prob needs to stack off regardless of what btn does.

Cap - KJo prob isn't strong enough to 3bet the majority of the time here but it's def good enough to 3bet once in a while so I don't hate it, he's the only one that didn't butcher pf imo. I do hate the cbet sizing though, and I think he's got a terrible hand to be betting with here given spr of the others. I'd like to see him check hands like this along with strong hands that need little protection (AhAx for instance), and 1/3rd pot betting strong hands that do need protection along with strong draws and weak draws with good blockers (T8s for instance).

The flop is a hit-or-miss "chicken" board. If it were heads-up, Capitalist would most certainly be c-betting something small like 1/3 pot. It is multiway, though, and Capitalist is out of position, with no heart in his hand. I would lean towards not betting here.

As played, NYSAG has absolute position. It is a hit-or-miss board, and NYSAG has a pair. But he is either somewhat ahead or way behind Capitalist's range, and there is another player to worry about, with best relative position, who can choose between closing the action or reopening it. In NYSAG's place I would fold (but I would have folded to the 3-bet preflop).

If NYSAG folds, or even if he flat-calls, NcDaddy should call. He should not fold. He should not raise. Raising will force out worse hands and get calls by better. NcDaddy is in a way-ahead/way-behind spot, and should call Capitalist's c-bet. If NYSAG raises, though, it's an easy fold.

NYSAG — open fine. Fold to 3bet, I think, but it’s close. Fold to flop bet because of the player behind (NC).

Cap — pre: okay once in a while to 3bet KJo, but he should usually call. Cbet into two players without a heart in hand is pretty spew.

NC — butchered pre, as others said. He should have 3bet the first time, and 4bet jammed the second time. Postflop: he’s at top of range and is committed to the hand, unless NYSAG does something OOL and raises flop. Check/call if NYSAG calls, check/call if NYSAG folds.

Although at this point he'll only have a 3/4 PSB left, and you could argue he is committed and shouldn't potentially giving free cards. So while it's true a raise is unlikely to get called by worse / fold out better, I think you could argue he simply has to commit at this point to protect his equity in a huge pot.

GcluelessNLnoobG

If the money is going in anyway, which would you rather do, fold out potential villain bluffs, or catch them?

If he's going to shove 100% of his range when we check to him on the turn, I'd be fine with that. But my guess would be Villain is less likely to bluff at this point with just a 3/4 PSB remaining. He's much more likely to just take a free card, and our life sucks if we let him do so and he binks.

GcluelessNLnoobG