The game is 1/2/2 NL. The minimum come-in to any pot is $4 (This means most open raises are anywhere from 8-11)

Hero ($200): 20's, White. New to the table. Has folded 1 orbit

Villain (~$250): Young guy, early/mid 20's. Headphones, Glasses. The only hand I saw him play he folded (and showed later) Aces on a 2 9 7 7 board with a bet and 2 calls to him. The river came a final 7 and he folded what would have been the best hand.

Note: This hand occured the very next hand after Villain had to toss Aces, and he seemed slightly frustrated.

Villain in UTG + 1 limps, Folds to Hero in HJ who raises to 14 with AdTd, folds to Villain who calls.

Flop ($28): Jh 8 2h

Villain checks, Hero bets $22, Villain calls

Turn ($72) Js

Villain checks, Hero checks

River ($72) 3h

Villain checks, Hero...

Can we make a profitable bluff here? Are we giving up the hand? What ranges can the villain be calling the flop but checking the turn (which pairs the board) and river (which completes a flush) with?

Any input would be great, results will be revealed later for those who want to know what happened.

Yes. He folds hands. If you feel cheeky, over bet shove here

i don't think there's a reason to bet here at the end. In my eyes he was drawing and so if he did miss, you're winning anyway. I'm inclined to think he's the cheeky one, checking his flush. More than likely i feel he missed but why get into some huge pot with A high?

I'd be interested in hearing a case for bluffing (and how much) in this situation. I feel like this is a case where if my hand was AJ instead of A high, I would check turn, bet river because you're not getting three streets of value very often, and villain is more likely to pay off in a thinner spot on the river. I would be more inclined to bet the turn with A high, as you have position, aggression, and on this board, you're making all draws pay and putting small-medium PPs to the test.

As played I check river.

b/f 50

you rep a flush and a flush only by betting river and checking turn, maybe a scared QQ-AA, but thats unlikely. and he folded last hand and might be tilted.
if you wanna bluff here, go big. i dont mind a bluff, and only being it for sickness reasons, but bet 130 at minimum to get him to think twice.

i dont like this thinking at all, c/behind with more or less the nuts and bet with A high having a little showdown value on a card which is great for villains range except he is drawing. fps imo.

if you want to bluf in this spot then go big at least $110....... i think its a good spot to do so against this guy

Interesting spot (can see how a big bet might work) especially as you have spotted that villain is willing to lay down a somewhat big hand (AA).

As played though i'd check the river (and curse my c-bet :-) (Maybe A8hh or maybe some kind of FD with overs to J on flop. imho no J from his play?). i'd also check because of your "note" -> more willing to call you after frustrated AA muck + you needing to bet big vs your stack.

How did it end up?

the guy folded AA face up the very last hand and was wrong. He is not going to hero fold again. Even though it's a decent repping card I think it's bad timing.

Spoiler Alert:

I bet 50 on the river, almost immediately.

Villain SNAP called and I told him he was good. Villain turned over KJ. (He played the hand very awkwardly)

Lessons to be learned:

Bluff bigger? (Realistically I felt that a flush draw would bet this size, expecting opponent does not have a Jack)

Mainly, don't play pots against a player who just folded Aces and is questioning himself...Their play can be very spontaneous + unpredictable.

I like the big preflop raise which narrows the field with us in position with initiative.

I cbet less on the flop, probably just 1/2 PSB. If villain has something, he'll call; if he doesn't, he'll fold, so no reason to bet more, imo. Pretty good chance he was set mining here and has whiffed; the size of the bet (as long as it's "reasonable") will have no bearing on whether he folds vs calls with an underpair here.

I'm pretty much done with the hand once called on the flop. I try to get to showdown for nothing where there's a chance A high will win against a busted draw.

I wouldn't bluff here. We still have a showdownable hand against a busted straight draw, and after we check the turn I just think so few hands are folding even though there's a possibility we play the flush draw this way. I just think we get looked up far too often here, even with a small pocket pair. ETA: And +1 to comments above regarding how tiltly guy who just folded the best hand is even less likely to fold anything here.

ETA: Other than preflop, I think villain played the hand well.

GcluelessNLnoobG

You cant really bluff the rvr that credibly once you check the turn..

Also you have no real indication that vill is weak enough to fold to a rvr bluff with the turn check...

Making any bet on the turn even really small will at least help u set up a bluff if he just calls (or a fold if raised) .. Also If your gonna bluff rvr it needs to be a large bet ( bigger than pot) like100

This will work some percentage of the time if and only if you can identify tht your vill is weak and narrow his range to below a J (in this case). If you cannot do this then you should likely be betting flop smallish then c/f ing both streets in this hand..

**grunch**

You showed weakness on the turn by checking behind. If he was a thinking player he would have overbet pot into you on the river. You won't have credibility for a J because you would have undoubtedly bet the turn with the flush draw and to gain value. So what are you representing here? A flush? Your hand has showdown value, I don't think it needs to be turned into a bluff here.... especially since you blew it on the turn.

I like a turn bet of 1/2 pot. ON tthis flop he is calling your cbet with any pair, Od straight draw, 2nd pair, any flush draw, and top pair +...

That's something like 67% of a limp calling range...my plan is to double barell on a lot of cards..(any card other then a Q T 9 7 or 8

The jacks make top pair less likely , though 2nd pair may call a little more. even if he now calls with all Jacks and 2nd pair...he will now call you with less then 50% of his hands..you only need him to fold out about 1/3 of his hands.

It also works as a reverse blocker so he does not bluff you off your Ace high on the river.


I can however see a case for not betting this flop, given that villain might be tilting...

This line often implies that the villain was calling to hit the heart, you gave him a free card on the turn. He's checking to induce a stab so he can come over the top with his flush. He's hoping you have the J IMO. If not he has the Jack and knows you're folding if he bets so he's still trying to get you to bet when you're beat. I don't know if villain is floating on the flop with nothing here.

nononononono do not bet bigger here. He's almost never folding a J or a flush and he's folding anything else when you bluff.

If anything you could bet 35-40 and probably get the same result.

What's spontaneous and unpredictable about a weak/tight 1/2 player check/calling with top pair turned into trips? It's exactly how they play top pair a lot of the time when you open pre.

Don't bluff the river. Villain just made a bad hero-fold so he's not likely to do it again and you don't rep much.

I probably wouldn't c-bet either with that flop texture, but there are a decent number of turns that you could consider a delayed c-bet on.

[QUOTE=
I can however see a case for not betting this flop, given that villain might be tilting...[/QUOTE]

I agree this player is calling you with any reasonable hand based on the last hand. He is especially calling because he "is not getting bluffed" twice in a row.....haha......timing is everything!!!

+1, I always appreciate your posts Rumor.

I think I just realized my biggest weakness as a player is playing against tight/passive player. I need to be more discipline on giving up a hand, and also pick my spots to bluff better (based on board texture, and whether I choose to bluff flop or turn, initially)

It's a tought spot. The cbet isnt a bad option after he ch flops. I like a smaller bet of $18. But after the ch/call on flop. The way the board ran out, I check turn, check river. After he calls flop, I put him on pocket pairs, J, or set. With another J on turn, he most likely will ch/call turn as well with those hands. J doesnt change much here. With him calling your flop bet of $22, I dont see this particular player drawing to flush or straight (holding 89). So I still put this player on a J, pocket pair, or monster. After he checks river, I eliminate him having a monster for I feel he wd most likely lead out. The river does bring a flush, but if you u want to rep flush u have to bet bigger than $50(thats why I bet smaller on flop, in case I hv to bluff river), but I dont like that option. He easily calls $50 here w J and perhaps still pocket pairs considering he doesnt want to get blufffed again. I wd just gv up, a $50 bet would only get rid of a couple hands that beat you. If u think he has 4s,5s,6s,7s then $50 wd work, but too risky. I wd just take a $32 loss here and win it back within the hour. You can find a lot better spots in a $1/2 game. No use trying to bluff against this player after him folding AA. He is more willing now to call with less, after seeing his AA fold was the winner.
Gd luck 2u

horrible spot. he has a made hand, you rep not much, he may call you light anyways b/c of history.