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Bluffing at 1/2 NL

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01-26-2022 , 03:46 PM

tmo1120

adept

Join Date: Aug 2018 Posts: 1,027

1/2 NL
roughly 400 eff.

ATos OTB to 15 after 2 limps, 2 callers ( UTG and CO)

Flop: JJ3 (r) , (45) , X'd to me and i cb 20 on this board, both players call

Turn: K , (105) , X'd through, Easy give up for me here

River:K , (105) , Utg leads for 40 , CO folds, I raise 120 more thinking the V can't have much KX besides KJ after calling the flop, I think trying to move him off a J here might be way too ambitious at this level but not sure?

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01-26-2022 , 03:59 PM

Perrone66

journeyman

Join Date: Aug 2019 Posts: 381

I don't mind pre, but given the sizing (bigish for 1/2) and getting two early position calls I'd be wary that I am up against some decentish hands.

I'd prob bet 15 on flop, and after two callers on that board I am shutting it down.

Turn I'd also x, and I'd very likely give up on river and fold.

If you had the K on the turn why slow down? AK which I'm sure many 1/2 players put most of their opponents on is going to like that turn card not x it back.

----

Info on V's matter, so does their stack sizes, and their views on you.

Overall I liked the pf raise, and flop c-bet, but after that I think it is spew.

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01-26-2022 , 04:10 PM

tmo1120

adept

Join Date: Aug 2018 Posts: 1,027

I think it makes sense to X some KX on the turn here given that the V's could easily have JX here and we may get value from a hand like 88 or 99 if we X turn and value bet river, I don't hate a small bet on the turn with a K but I think I like X'ing the turn with KX, we can also induce the occasional bluff , It did feel like I am the player that can have all the kX here and he can only really have KJ if he has a K, but he could just be floating the flop with KQ even tho it should be a fold with a player behind

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01-26-2022 , 05:25 PM

Phobos90

centurion

Join Date: Jan 2022 Posts: 144

I think it is totally unnecesary.

Thats fold river 90%

He shouldnt be floating there with Kx as its a rainbow board and there is a bet and a caller behind. So he is never calling with that unless Kj of course.

So he has Jx or a bluff with 44 55 66 77 88 type of hand.

Btw i like even more the call than the raise. Raise has no sense at all specially in this lvls your rarely gonna make fold a jack there.... and if u want to bluff that u should overbet it. I dont recommend u though.

But the std thing here is folding

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01-26-2022 , 05:25 PM

MHE

banned

Join Date: Sep 2020 Posts: 459

There really should be a mantra here, "Bluffing at low-stakes.....DON'T DO IT!" Your life would be so much easier.

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01-26-2022 , 05:50 PM

atenesq

journeyman

Join Date: Apr 2010 Posts: 341

Quote:

Originally Posted by tmo1120

If what you think you're repping to a 1/2 player requires this many words to explain, I promise you're wrong.

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01-26-2022 , 06:17 PM

venice10

Referee

Join Date: Nov 2007 Posts: 25,855

The raise on the river is too ambitious for any level. Your story makes no sense. If you're going to bluff at it, you should have bet the turn.

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01-26-2022 , 09:48 PM

hitchens97

veteran

Join Date: Mar 2011 Posts: 2,455

"Bluffing at 1/2 NL"

Short Answer: Don't

Long Answer:

You don't make your money in 1/2 by bluffing because so much of the population are loose passive calling stations. Apart from c-betting and semi-bluffs (e.g. where I have some good equity if called), I really don't generally outright make big bluffs at 1/2 or 1/3 unless I have some specific reads/experience with the player(s) I'm bluffing.

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01-26-2022 , 10:06 PM

nutsornot

journeyman

Join Date: May 2019 Posts: 241

I don't think your going to run into many 1/2 players that:

A) Will fold flopped trips with 200bb stacks, no matter the run out

B) Are capable of bet folding the river for value, especially vs your sizing

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01-26-2022 , 10:46 PM

#10

Tonyarab1

banned

Join Date: Jan 2022 Posts: 58

When the king comes on the turn you should have bet it. That card is in your range. You're the preflop raiser. That K hits you 75% of the time.

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01-27-2022 , 04:24 AM

#11

tmo1120

adept

Join Date: Aug 2018 Posts: 1,027

Quote:

Originally Posted by venice10

The raise on the river is too ambitious for any level. Your story makes no sense. If you're going to bluff at it, you should have bet the turn.

I'm not trying to defend my play here, I don't like it too much (prob my worst play of the session) , however i think it's an interesting spot for a higher stakes game , I think I do a lot of Checking with KX on this turn, My KX combo's will require very little protection on a board like this, one of the other players could easily have a J given that they naturally checked to the Pre-flop raiser , I think KX could be bet on the turn but it could also easily be checked. therefore i simply think i arrive on the river with much more KX than my opponent

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01-27-2022 , 04:27 AM

#12

tmo1120

adept

Join Date: Aug 2018 Posts: 1,027

Quote:

Originally Posted by Phobos90

Btw i like even more the call than the raise. Raise has no sense at all specially in this lvls your rarely gonna make fold a jack there.... and if u want to bluff that u should overbet it. I dont recommend u though.

But the std thing here is folding

I didn't even consider my showdown value here, that is a good point, I do beat some counterfeit PP's and im getting better than 3 to 1. totally reasonable to call there now that i think of it

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01-27-2022 , 05:48 PM

#13

Double K

grinder

Join Date: Jan 2020 Posts: 618

Utg limps make me very cautious. A better line would be to check flop and bet turn. AP he’s never folding a J

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01-27-2022 , 06:59 PM

#14

Lordkjun

adept

Join Date: May 2010 Posts: 746

Quote:

Originally Posted by atenesq

If what you think you're repping to a 1/2 player requires this many words to explain, I promise you're wrong.

Lol I love this quote.

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01-27-2022 , 11:09 PM

#15

AceDeuceSuited

journeyman

Join Date: Sep 2021 Posts: 262

Noob perspective:

Seems pretty standard through the turn. If you were going to bluff, I would have fired another bullet right there. Maybe someone's calling with Jx, but if they're not, the K is a great scare card.

On the river, this is either a fold or a call for me. I don't think you're getting any J to fold, and you have showdown value against anything that doesn't include a K or J (they're not limp/calling flop with AA or QQ). After the check-through on the turn, it's plausible they just floated the flop, or had a 3 or a medium pocket pair, and are taking a stab at it thinking nobody has a piece.

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01-28-2022 , 12:57 AM

#16

Dream Crusher

banned

Join Date: Mar 2016 Posts: 18,786

King on the turn is the single best bluff card for your range. I agree with others though that you simply shouldn't bluff that often at low stakes.

The raise on the river is bad because you are never folding out better and never getting called by worse. In this spot, you can only call or fold.

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01-28-2022 , 08:15 PM

#17

atenesq

journeyman

Join Date: Apr 2010 Posts: 341

Quote:

Originally Posted by tmo1120

I'm not trying to defend my play here, I don't like it too much (prob my worst play of the session) , however i think it's an interesting spot for a higher stakes game

You're really trying to thread the needle here. What villain in what game at what stakes is both buying your Kx story AND playing Jx like this?

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01-30-2022 , 05:47 PM

#18

drowski

old hand

Join Date: Nov 2007 Posts: 1,519

If you're going to bluff it needs to be bigger. 180 should get most jacks to fold imo. Obv player dependent but it's not a terrible line.

If I had AK or KQ this is exactly how I would play it. Not sure why everyone thinks betting turn is good with either of those hands. It's not

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01-30-2022 , 09:02 PM

#19

NittyOldMan1

old hand

Join Date: Sep 2014 Posts: 1,452

limp pre

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