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Becoming a stone cold killer Becoming a stone cold killer

06-17-2015 , 02:50 PM
This is my first post. Sorry if this is the wrong forum. I play live $1/$3, $2/$5 NLH.

I feel like my biggest leak at the moment is controlling my emotions while bluffing. As the hand progresses I will become more and more nervous. If I c bet, followed by double barrelling the turn, by the river I am fighting an urge to swallow and my face is ridden with fear and anxiety. Observant opponents frequently pick me off here with very marginal hands. I am so hyper aware of my demeaner in these spots that my brain shuts down and I stop thinking about my opponents range, his stack, the merits of a third barrel on the river.

Advice? Any exercises I can work on the overcome this? Books on the subject?
Becoming a stone cold killer Quote
06-17-2015 , 02:55 PM
It might have less to do with your face, and more to do with the betting pattern than you think. Post some hands, and let's analyze them.
As for inner game, the more you do something and are successful, the more comfortable you will feel. Again, analyzing your choices of bluffing spots will help.
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06-17-2015 , 02:56 PM
Bluff less.

Make sure your bluff tells a story that makes sense.

Take time to consider your opponents' hand ranges.

Do this when you have a made hand as well, so it's not apparent.

Adjust your bluffing and value betting ranges to what you know of your opponents.

Bluff less.
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06-17-2015 , 03:45 PM
Also, sounds like you might be scared money. How's your poker bankroll?

Why do you think your villains even have a fold button at all? Sometimes, they just will not fold their crappy cards no matter what.

W/o any further info, I think I would advise you to stop bluffing at all for a while. Get lots more time behind the wheel and then look for places where a good bluff will work.

Mindless cbetting is highly overrated.
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06-17-2015 , 04:10 PM
If you bluffing out of your playbook completely, you probably wouldn't be too far off optimal at 1/3 NL (a bit of an exaggeration for sure, but not by much).

ETA: Part of the problem, which I'm simply basing on the title of your thread alone, is that perhaps you don't understand how this game is crushed. It's crushed a lot less glamorously than you think.

GcluelessNLnoobG

Last edited by gobbledygeek; 06-17-2015 at 04:17 PM.
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06-17-2015 , 04:12 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lapidator
Also, sounds like you might be scared money. How's your poker bankroll?

Why do you think your villains even have a fold button at all? Sometimes, they just will not fold their crappy cards no matter what.

W/o any further info, I think I would advise you to stop bluffing at all for a while. Get lots more time behind the wheel and then look for places where a good bluff will work.

Mindless cbetting is highly overrated.
Preach.
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06-17-2015 , 04:30 PM
Merge your swallowing and facial anxiety range.
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06-17-2015 , 04:33 PM
Visualize you have what you want to rep.

And bluff less.

And semibluff more.
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06-17-2015 , 04:37 PM
Did we all mention bluff less?

At low stakes the way you make $ is by exploiting opponent tendencies to not fold marginal hands, not by bluffing them out of pots. Because no one folds at low stakes.
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06-17-2015 , 04:48 PM
I don't want to steer OP in the wrong direction but I would guesstimate that 30-50% of the pots I win I don't even have a hand. That said, it took me hundreds of hours of experimentation to figure out when to apply pressure and when to ease off the gas (and why I am continuing to refine my game at 1/2 rather than take shots or move up to 2/5).
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06-17-2015 , 05:04 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by johnnyBuz
I don't want to steer OP in the wrong direction but I would guesstimate that 30-50% of the pots I win I don't even have a hand. That said, it took me hundreds of hours of experimentation to figure out when to apply pressure and when to ease off the gas (and why I am continuing to refine my game at 1/2 rather than take shots or move up to 2/5).
Hourly during these 100's of hours?
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06-17-2015 , 05:13 PM
OP,

Another thing to work on: Just look at the flop during the hand.

Don't look at your cards. Don't look at your chips. Don't look at your villain. Don't look at the dealer. Don't look at the scantly clad waitress (until the hand is over).

Whether you are bluffing or not. Just look at the flop.
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06-17-2015 , 05:17 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lapidator
OP,

Another thing to work on: Just look at the flop during the hand.

Don't look at your cards. Don't look at your chips. Don't look at your villain. Don't look at the dealer. Don't look at the scantly clad waitress (until the hand is over).

Whether you are bluffing or not. Just look at the flop.
This is a good strategy. I like playing with my chips with both hands in front of me to distract me, works better for me then starring at the non-moving flop.
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06-17-2015 , 05:25 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lapidator
Hourly during these 100's of hours?
Running about $32/hr over my last 325 hours. $20/hr over last 500 hours.
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06-17-2015 , 05:34 PM
If you're taking a lot of caffeine or other stimulants, lay off those.

Make sure to exercise. It will help release stress and other things which might be making you nervous.

Maybe take up meditation or yoga or something.

If all else fails look for some supplements to help relax you. Something like l-theanine.
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06-17-2015 , 09:38 PM
It is more of you not reading your opponents than anything else. Doubling barreling is a fairly advanced skill. You should know what turns help the scare factor of your bet. People believe that poker is about making sick bluffs. The reality is that most of your money is made having people calling with crap before they give up. LLSNL players didn't come to the poker room to fold. Once you understand that, you'll spend less time trying to blow people off made hands.
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06-17-2015 , 09:42 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by cAmmAndo
Merge your swallowing and facial anxiety range.
That takes a bit of work.
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06-17-2015 , 10:03 PM
Your range is your range man! Rep it and rep it well, whether you actually have it or not...
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06-17-2015 , 10:45 PM
This is exactly what you need - an exceptional post from the legendary AintNoLimit.

Quote:
Originally Posted by AintNoLimit
What i teach that works really well is called SBRTA.

Stop - Breath (deep breath)- Relax - Think - then ACT.

Stand behind a friend and play his hand mentally as he plays. You will find that you play much better from this vantage point. Why? Because you are not emotionally and monetarily attached to the pot. Folding big hands becomes clear as day where the hero in the pot will for sure make more calls than he should there. Emotions trump logic everytime until you realize it and put safeguards into place to prevent it from happening.

When you SBRTA, you are attempting to remove yourself from the emotion of that hand as well as the money you are tied to. When u go home you will have no regrets as you played every major decision only after total consideration of all factors and removed yourself from the emotions of the hand as best as possible.

If you do this religiously in game, you will find that your mistakes will be cut down to a minimum (obviously you must know the correct plays etc to begin with), and will play as perfect as you can for your current skill level.

Coming to terms with yourself about the real validity of any single hand is another epiphany that higher level players have conquered. KNowing that any single hand means nothing, and being confident that if you play each hand as if you are playing 1000 hand trials each time is vital.
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06-18-2015 , 05:19 AM
As another poster mentioned briefly, exercise is extremely important.

I can't tell you how many times I've picked up on breathing tells from overweight opponents.
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06-18-2015 , 12:57 PM
Away from the felt... practice meditation and learning to breathe from deep within your belly focusing intently on your breath, keeping it steady and even. When these situations arise fall back on that and you should find yourself much calmer. Do the same when you're betting with the nuts.
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06-18-2015 , 02:10 PM
Mostly people suck at bluffing. If you think it's nerves or w/e keep playing; it will go away.
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06-18-2015 , 02:28 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by venice10
It is more of you not reading your opponents than anything else. Doubling barreling is a fairly advanced skill. You should know what turns help the scare factor of your bet. People believe that poker is about making sick bluffs. The reality is that most of your money is made having people calling with crap before they give up. LLSNL players didn't come to the poker room to fold. Once you understand that, you'll spend less time trying to blow people off made hands.
Yep.

Pretty sure when you are comfortable enough with hand ranging, "bluffs" are no longer what you think they mean.
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06-18-2015 , 07:37 PM
Should we not learn how to control our emotions, craft bluffs, at the lower stakes rather than when we move up?
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06-19-2015 , 10:07 PM
FWIW, I found the following video helpful in determining which flops to bluff and which to check back. Nikachu starts his discussion at 1:06.



As far as physical reactions go, I'll just say that at some point you get used to having a playbook in your mind. When I hit bottom set heads up in position against a fish who called from BB on AJ3hss, I bet 2/3 pot. When I flop a gutshot heads up in position against a fish who called from BB on K62r, I also bet 2/3 pot. One hand is part of my value range, the other hand is part of my bluffing/semi-bluffing range. I've predetermined that I will bet in both situations, so I don't show any emotion when I make that bet.
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