AA on QJT two-tone board: Should I overbet shove? - Live Low-stakes No Limit Poker Forum

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AA on QJT two-tone board: Should I overbet shove?

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02-08-2016 , 06:31 AM

6betfold

old hand

Join Date: Feb 2015 Posts: 1,403

6 players

UTG almost busted last hand and raises all-in for 5 BBs
Fish (UTG+2) calls
Folds to Hero in BB who re-raises to 13 BBs with A

Fish calls

Flop (31 BBs): Q

Hero ? (We effectively have 63 BBs behind)

Horridly scary flop for me. Overbet shove?

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02-08-2016 , 10:14 AM

GrandTheftOtto

journeyman

Join Date: Dec 2015 Posts: 197

Why is this a horridly scary flop against a fish?

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02-08-2016 , 10:23 AM

KKingDavid

grinder

Join Date: Aug 2011 Posts: 591

How does fish play his draws-- if you check, if you bet smallish, is you bet larger, if you overbet shove? How does he play 2-pair plus?

You need to get him to tell you what he has, by his actions.

Overbet shove... Would this be for value or as a bluff?

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02-08-2016 , 10:36 AM

johnny_on_the_spot

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Jun 2013 Posts: 11,665

Why did you 3bet so light pre?

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02-08-2016 , 11:43 AM

BackDoorFlush

veteran

Join Date: Nov 2013 Posts: 2,171

Your 3! is too small.
Make a standard c-bet, and call if he shoves.

This flop is pretty good for your hand. I'm not sure why you hate it with such short stacks.

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02-08-2016 , 01:26 PM

6betfold

old hand

Join Date: Feb 2015 Posts: 1,403

Quote:

Originally Posted by KKingDavid

Protection?

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02-08-2016 , 01:27 PM

6betfold

old hand

Join Date: Feb 2015 Posts: 1,403

I 3! small because we were not that deep and I didn't want to lose him by reraising huge. What size do you guys recommend?

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02-08-2016 , 01:28 PM

6betfold

old hand

Join Date: Feb 2015 Posts: 1,403

Quote:

Originally Posted by BackDoorFlush

This flop is pretty good for your hand. I'm not sure why you hate it with such short stacks.

Because of all the draws out there.

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02-08-2016 , 01:37 PM

DrDanimal

old hand

Join Date: Nov 2011 Posts: 1,533

Raise to 18-20 bb pre, shove flop, plan your hands in advance, set these things up

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02-08-2016 , 01:38 PM

#10

KKingDavid

grinder

Join Date: Aug 2011 Posts: 591

Quote:

Originally Posted by 6betfold

Protection?

A bet for protection is one that gives draws poor odds to call, and prevents draws from getting a free card. 2/3 to 3/4 pot will do fine as a protection bet.

Here, you don't know that V is on a draw yet, only that the board is very wet.

You also don't know that V doesn't already have you crushed, with a flopped straight, set or 2-pair.

So make a fairly standard 2/3 pot C-bet. If he only raises with 2-pair + hands, and raises or shoves, you can fold. If he raises or shoves draws, and raises, you have to call. If he calls with 1-pairs and draws, you can shove any safe turn card.

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02-08-2016 , 01:40 PM

#11

Trev

grinder

Join Date: Dec 2012 Posts: 471

This short it seems like an easy bet/call. Or shove turn. Doubt he has sets or AK often at all. Sure he has 2 pair hands but also one pair hands or pair+draw hands that call down or get it in. Easy hand this short. And 3bet slightly larger.

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02-08-2016 , 01:42 PM

#12

Trev

grinder

Join Date: Dec 2012 Posts: 471

Overbet shove just makes it easier for him to play correctly.

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02-08-2016 , 01:50 PM

#13

johnny_on_the_spot

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Jun 2013 Posts: 11,665

Quote:

Originally Posted by 6betfold

I 3! small because we were not that deep and I didn't want to lose him by reraising huge. What size do you guys recommend?

We're 76bb deep, I'd typically play normally against that. 20bb +/- a few for the 3! sizing

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02-09-2016 , 03:09 PM

#14

gobbledygeek

Poet Laureate of LLSNL

Join Date: Jul 2006 Posts: 36,600

I'll assume this is 1/3, so $228 stacks.

When I 3bet I typically try to offer 8:1 implied odds so that it makes setmining (and thus all other speculative hand mining) unprofitable (especially considering we almost always have to stack off postflop due to very small SPRs in 3bet pots). So I woulda raised to about $50 preflop.

I would also shove this flop for 2xPSB. Fish ain't never folding with any pair / any draw (and especially pair + draw).

GcluelessNLnoobG

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