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5otb, set of AA, bet or check?

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06-11-2020 , 10:21 AM

Nick94

newbie

Join Date: Mar 2020 Posts: 16

5 on the button 550E stacks.
EP makes it 15 one caller,
I am in CO with AA no heart and make it 65 and both call, both pretty loose and fishy.

Flop is A23 2 hearts I bet 120 into 200 and both check call,

Turn is a 4h, cc and I checked and in retrospect think Prob just jam is best?

I shouldn't be giving any more freecards. I could see either one of them having a random 5 in their range even tho they shouldn't based on pf action and Since I have most of the As and have no heart then I dont block obv fds.

Last edited by Garick; 06-11-2020 at 10:42 AM. Reason: paras

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06-11-2020 , 10:33 AM

venice10

Referee

Join Date: Nov 2007 Posts: 25,857

A check is the right decision on this board. Pretty hard for anything worse to call another bet which is going to be essentially all in.

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06-11-2020 , 10:40 AM

Garick

Oberbiergenießer

Join Date: Dec 2007 Posts: 26,524

What does "5 on the button" mean? Odd blind structure?

Is the ace on the board a heart?

With the pot at 560 and only 365 effective behind, I like a turn jam, especially if the A on the board is not a heart. You're committed now, and there are a lot of river cards that can kill your hand or your action.

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06-11-2020 , 11:49 AM

tmo1120

adept

Join Date: Aug 2018 Posts: 1,027

I go larger pre in this straddled pot.

Probably could go larger on the flop as well

OTT i think checking is fine bc you block all the AX so what does that leave ? probably draws , and one of them probably got there

especially unblocking AX , it's a really annoying turn card so i feel your pain here but i don't think jamming is play ott

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06-11-2020 , 12:37 PM

eric5556

enthusiast

Join Date: May 2017 Posts: 73

Garick, why would you want the A on board to not be a heart to jam? I would think I would want it to be a heart to greatly reduce the number of flushes out there.

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06-11-2020 , 12:46 PM

Garick

Oberbiergenießer

Join Date: Dec 2007 Posts: 26,524

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I go larger pre in this straddled pot.

It's a pot-sized 3-bet. How much larger could you go?

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Probably could go larger on the flop as well

Board is pretty dry. Much larger and we likely lose the weaker aces and the PPs that might call one bet in case we are one-and-done.

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Garick, why would you want the A on board to not be a heart to jam? I would think I would want it to be a heart to greatly reduce the number of flushes out there.

I want the weaker aces to have the backdoor draw in their range in order to be able to call the jam. I want value, not folds.

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06-11-2020 , 12:52 PM

Mat the Gambler

adept

Join Date: Feb 2010 Posts: 1,170

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nick94

I shouldn't be giving any more freecards. I could see either one of them having a random 5 in their range even tho they shouldn't based on pf action and Since I have most of the As and have no heart then I dont block obv fds.

When you might already be behind, don't worry about free cards. Be more worried about what happens if you get checkraised. You might get a fourth heart or a 5 on the river. A 5 means you're probably chopping and a fourth heart makes it easy for you to fold to any sized bet.

But what if someone already has a straight or flush, slowplayed it hoping you'd bet so they can checkraise and then the board pairs? You're going to get some value.

Easy check. If the river is a blank, you check-call.

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06-11-2020 , 01:02 PM

Garick

Oberbiergenießer

Join Date: Dec 2007 Posts: 26,524

I gotta say, this level of mubsiness in a 3-bet pot with top set and a flop SPR of less than 2.5:1 is really weirding me out. How many 5s are in a raise/call pre range?

Yes, there could be some flushes out there, but not a ton, and we have 20-23% against them (depending on whether they block the last ace) to fall back on.

Meanwhile, there are a ton of weaker TP that are basically pot committed, and a bunch of randomly having one heart hands (some of which also fit in the previous category) that will call our under 2/3-pot sized shove.

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06-11-2020 , 01:11 PM

Nick94

newbie

Join Date: Mar 2020 Posts: 16

What amount do you check call up to on say a blank 9riv? As played tho riv brought in the 5h got jammed on folded and showed 56 no heart

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06-11-2020 , 01:13 PM

#10

Nick94

newbie

Join Date: Mar 2020 Posts: 16

Oh and 5otb is a west texas thing, no sb or bb just a blind on the button

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06-11-2020 , 01:30 PM

#11

Garick

Oberbiergenießer

Join Date: Dec 2007 Posts: 26,524

Ahh. Worth mentioning that you're in Texas next time, as those games play pretty wild. Less shocked that there's a random 5 in V's range in a Texas game, but still a bit surprised.

I still think it's a jam OTT, tbh, just given the SPR in a 3-bet pot, but definitely higher variance in Texas. I think you get enough calls from crappy aces to make up for the increased 5x range, tho.

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06-11-2020 , 04:58 PM

#12

tmo1120

adept

Join Date: Aug 2018 Posts: 1,027

Quote:

Originally Posted by Garick

It's a pot-sized 3-bet. How much larger could you go?

Board is pretty dry. Much larger and we likely lose the weaker aces and the PPs that might call one bet in case we are one-and-done.

I want the weaker aces to have the backdoor draw in their range in order to be able to call the jam. I want value, not folds.

4x + the trail = 80 , i would like to go 80 here preflop at least, a UTG open in a straddled pot represents a strong range and with the dead money out there i just think we gotta go bigger

We block a lot of the AX that our opponent could have , i'm not too concerned with losing weak AX , not many weak AX in UTG opening range; i'm not saying overbet the flop, the 120 into 200 isn;t bad at all , 150-170 is fine too i think

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06-11-2020 , 05:01 PM

#13

tmo1120

adept

Join Date: Aug 2018 Posts: 1,027

Quote:

Originally Posted by Garick

I gotta say, this level of mubsiness in a 3-bet pot with top set and a flop SPR of less than 2.5:1 is really weirding me out. How many 5s are in a raise/call pre range?
.

It's not really about being scared as much as it is about respecting the multi-way nature of the pot, it just makes it really hard to get value with a one-liner out there and 3 to a flush

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06-11-2020 , 11:46 PM

#14

Nick94

newbie

Join Date: Mar 2020 Posts: 16

Quote:

Originally Posted by tmo1120

There was no straddle, just 5$ on the button, no sb and bb, was made 15 and one caller so I just did standard 3x 3 bet plus 15 for the caller, I think 65 is fine especially ip but Given that these were the 2 loosest players at the table I do like maybe 75 better

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06-12-2020 , 02:57 AM

#15

jdr0317

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Jan 2012 Posts: 8,231

Quote:

Originally Posted by Garick

Important to note that the more 5x is in their range, the more AxR❤️ in their range. So things kind of balance out a bit.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

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06-12-2020 , 10:54 AM

#16

tmo1120

adept

Join Date: Aug 2018 Posts: 1,027

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nick94

oh its not a button straddle? does button have option if nobody raises and it gets back to him?

I never heard of that before but the games in FL all have the option to button straddle so i thought thats what it was

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06-12-2020 , 10:55 AM

#17

tmo1120

adept

Join Date: Aug 2018 Posts: 1,027

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nick94

I thought you were OOP for some reason , yea i guess you don't have to go too large then

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06-13-2020 , 12:04 AM

#18

RoadtoPro

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Jan 2019 Posts: 6,600

I love 5otb. c/eval turn seems good. River heart is unlikely.

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