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5-5 Live: 66 flops a set 180bb deep 5-5 Live: 66 flops a set 180bb deep

08-28-2008 , 07:18 AM
Villain is an older Asian gentleman. He has been playing tighter than average. Nonetheless he is still prone to calling any connector, I saw him limp t8o in MP. He is on his second $500 buy in. He lost the first when he raised 3bb with ATo UTG+1 and got 5 callers. Flop AK3, he bets pot, semi-steaming semi-LAG pushes from the button. Villain deliberates muttering a possible range, finally calling to see A3o. Since then he has doubled up, mostly without showing down a hand taking down pots with large bets and raises.

My image should be TAG as I haven’t shown down any garbage or played many hands. At the beginning of the session I raised a bleeding limper with 99, flopped a set and played it fast through the river. I recently (two orbits) doubled up with KK from the SB with $400. I raise to $55 after four limpers, BB calls, two limpers call and two fold. Flop T64. I open push $350 into the $280 pot. BB calls with AT I win.

Villain and I have crossed paths in two hands with effective stacks of 75-100bb. First hand I raise TT to $45 after a weak limper, villain calls from the BB, limper folds. Flop Q92r. He checks, I bet $35, he min raises to $70, I call. Turn K checked. River 9 checked. He had AQo

The second hand he limped UTG with 4 limps behind, I raise KQs on the button to $40 he reraises to $140, all fold.

Hand in question:

Effective stacks $900

66 utg + 1. I raise to $15 after one limper, villain calls in MP, 3 calls, blinds fold, limper calls.

Flop Q76. Pot $90

Check, Bet $55, Villains calls. Everyone else folds.

Turn 4 Pot $200

Bet $75, villain thinks for a while and raises to $275. I reraised all-in really thinking he would call with worse.

All comments are appreciated. I am transitioning from limit cash games and NL MTT.
5-5 Live: 66 flops a set 180bb deep Quote
08-28-2008 , 09:42 AM
Well. As you played it , I snapcall.

Your PF raise is to thin IMO.

I either limp or make it like 25-30, prefering limping. The 15 gives great odds for any connectors in LP. That might have you beat on the turn. As played I call.
5-5 Live: 66 flops a set 180bb deep Quote
08-28-2008 , 09:44 AM
Pf: You're giving huge odds especially since you're deep and you have tight image. One limper utg+1 and you raise 3 BB... I don't think these pot sweeteners work.

Either limp behind or make it minimum $ 25 here.

The flop is super drawy. Make it at least 2/3 but more likely 3/4 of a pot.

The turn bet sizing is dreadly awful. You're betting 1/3 of a pot. Any draw or Q can call cheaply or even raise. Since the raise is really what you wanted and the villain can still having a lot of hands you beat + your line looks like huge amount of crap, I'm stacking off here but not happy about it. Due to deep stacked and that small raise pre, I can really see live villains having hands like 85 sooted here however.

Another option is calling and shoving a blank river which is fine too.

Last edited by Imaginary F(r)iend; 08-28-2008 at 09:51 AM.
5-5 Live: 66 flops a set 180bb deep Quote
08-28-2008 , 10:21 AM
Raise bigger preflop. Bet bigger on flop. Bet bigger on turn. Ship it in when you get raised on the turn.
5-5 Live: 66 flops a set 180bb deep Quote
08-28-2008 , 11:08 AM
I don't agree with the critcisms of your pre-flop raise. I'm certainly not limping. And, I don't want to make a larger raise ($25-$30) to make people fold. That includes making them fold 85s or better suited connectors. In these spots, I want to size the raise so that it's small enough that my opponents will play any hand they wanted to limp with. $15 in early position or $20 in later position after limpers usually does this.

Of course, you have to consider how deep everybody else at the table is.


As far as the rest of the hand goes, when you see the flop, you should be trying to get all-in. The turn card didn't change anything.

You are betting too small on the flop and turn- not because I'd want to fold out draws but because I think draws will call larger bets.
5-5 Live: 66 flops a set 180bb deep Quote
08-28-2008 , 12:37 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dynasty
I don't agree with the critcisms of your pre-flop raise. I'm certainly not limping. And, I don't want to make a larger raise ($25-$30) to make people fold. That includes making them fold 85s or better suited connectors. In these spots, I want to size the raise so that it's small enough that my opponents will play any hand they wanted to limp with. $15 in early position or $20 in later position after limpers usually does this.
I think your pf tactics might work, but for someone doing a transistion from limit to no-limit, it might be easier to go for ABC for a while. Overall, this is just fooling around and will on the long run expose your cards?

Anyways, whenever someone does those small raises, I just love to slam the pot on position with AQ+, 99+.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dynasty
You are betting too small on the flop and turn- not because I'd want to fold out draws but because I think draws will call larger bets.
o rly?
5-5 Live: 66 flops a set 180bb deep Quote
08-28-2008 , 06:51 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Imaginary F(r)iend
Anyways, whenever someone does those small raises, I just love to slam the pot on position with AQ+, 99+.

And I love to shove over your 3-bet when you mistake my small raise size for weakness.
5-5 Live: 66 flops a set 180bb deep Quote
08-29-2008 , 12:57 AM
just limp PF... theres really no reason not to.... wtf are you people talking about raising more.. with 66 utg+1... so you like almost no flops and your out of position against who knows how many callers
5-5 Live: 66 flops a set 180bb deep Quote
08-30-2008 , 02:04 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dynasty
I don't agree with the critcisms of your pre-flop raise. I'm certainly not limping. And, I don't want to make a larger raise ($25-$30) to make people fold. That includes making them fold 85s or better suited connectors. In these spots, I want to size the raise so that it's small enough that my opponents will play any hand they wanted to limp with. $15 in early position or $20 in later position after limpers usually does this.

Of course, you have to consider how deep everybody else at the table is.


As far as the rest of the hand goes, when you see the flop, you should be trying to get all-in. The turn card didn't change anything.

You are betting too small on the flop and turn- not because I'd want to fold out draws but because I think draws will call larger bets.
Well said.
5-5 Live: 66 flops a set 180bb deep Quote
08-30-2008 , 05:25 PM
wtf 3x bb pre raise is totally standard, he's playing 200 BBs deep and making it 3x will juice the pot just fine. Raising to 6x in a live FR 5-5 game w/ 66 in EP is tremendously leaky and a huge mistake. Your hand plays terrible OOP and live FR you will probably get 2+ callers.

As Dynasty said, turn changes nothing and you should be thinking of how to get your money AI here. I don't really like the turn shove at all, as you're letting a hand like AQ off the hook. Your turn bet is too small - you should be trying to set up your bets at this point to get as big of a river bet in as possible. I would bet $125 on turn to set up ~$300 on river.

As played, it sounds kind of weird/gross and minraising is rarely a good play, but I might minraise $200 on the turn and openshove river with stacksizes. This is a terrible line to take online but live I think it is the best option.
5-5 Live: 66 flops a set 180bb deep Quote
08-30-2008 , 07:53 PM
Dynasty nailed this one...
5-5 Live: 66 flops a set 180bb deep Quote

      
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