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/ NL: Thin Value Raise OTR? / NL: Thin Value Raise OTR?

06-29-2014 , 09:13 PM
$1000 eff. My image TAG, on the tighter side. MP raises to $30 preflop, I call in CO with QdTd, blinds call.

Flop: Js9d2h Pot ~ $120 All check.
Turn: 6s All check.
River: Ks SB checks, BB bets $70.

You and why? Feedback on earlier streets very welcome!
/ NL: Thin Value Raise OTR? Quote
06-29-2014 , 10:58 PM
fold pre, check flop, bet turn, raise river to 200ish. if V shoves we can reeval but probably have to give him credit for a flush because of the post flop action. (he can really have anything)
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06-29-2014 , 11:20 PM
If you can't profitably call or 3bet this hand, then I would just get up and leave.

Definitely raise river.
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06-29-2014 , 11:29 PM
raise river to 170
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06-30-2014 , 04:36 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Muffin Man
If you can't profitably call or 3bet this hand, then I would just unplug the life support so your loved ones can move on
Bet flop.
/ NL: Thin Value Raise OTR? Quote
06-30-2014 , 05:37 AM
what NSB said
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06-30-2014 , 09:40 AM
Isn't this a classic raise-fold (merge) situation on the river? Also, no reason not to bet flop when checked-to in position with tight image. That's sort of the whole point of playing this hand.
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06-30-2014 , 12:35 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by IronedSheik
Isn't this a classic raise-fold (merge) situation on the river? Also, no reason not to bet flop when checked-to in position with tight image. That's sort of the whole point of playing this hand.
1. What's bolded?

2. I thought about betting OTF but I didn't want to do it into 3 people when I could just take a free card. Anyway if we bet and brick turn, what's your plan for the turn/river?
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06-30-2014 , 12:58 PM
bet flop

220 now
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06-30-2014 , 01:31 PM
1. I'm probably using it imprecisely, but a "merge" is basically where you are betting thinly enough and under certain circumstances that you could simultaneously (sometimes) get better hands to fold while (sometimes) getting worse hands to call. Or, more pessimistically, where you're just pushing buttons and it has the "merge" result. Could a baby flush fold if you make it 220 OTR? At least sometimes, depending on the game/villain and your image.

BTW, in your scenario, if MP were loose/stupid, you could make an argument for just calling if you think he would overcall with AK.

2. Bet flop, check back brick turn (often), evaluate river depending on runout. The benefit of position is you get to decide OTT about a free card. Bet the flop to thin the field (e.g., by the river, wouldn't you have liked to have gotten one-pair-plus-spades hands out earlier?), protect your equity and, if a regular game, balance your range. You want three streets with 99, too.
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07-01-2014 , 01:50 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by IronedSheik
2. Bet flop, check back brick turn (often), evaluate river depending on runout. The benefit of position is you get to decide OTT about a free card. Bet the flop to thin the field (e.g., by the river, wouldn't you have liked to have gotten one-pair-plus-spades hands out earlier?), protect your equity and, if a regular game, balance your range. You want three streets with 99, too.
Bolded. That assumes turn is checked to us. What if we brick turn and someone leads into us?
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07-01-2014 , 02:09 PM
Why in the world are you not betting on the flop??? and yes raise river to about $220-$240....fold to a re-raise.

Just being honest here but I've read plenty of your posts in the past and recently since you moved up in stakes....seems like 5/10 has turned you into a passive player. Step back down to 2/5 until you're comfortable with the money....playing this way is just going to get you smashed at 5/10. This isn't said with the intention of being mean....said with the intention of wanting to see you keep your bankroll together.
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07-01-2014 , 02:14 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Olaff
1. What's bolded?

2. I thought about betting OTF but I didn't want to do it into 3 people when I could just take a free card. Anyway if we bet and brick turn, what's your plan for the turn/river?
Your goal when betting the flop is to take down the pot right there or to build a pot so that when you do hit your hand, you get some value for it....

Whether to continue on turn is somewhat dependent on which villain calls you down. If turn is a brick, they check, now you can always take a free card to see river.
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07-02-2014 , 10:02 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by OSUTexan
Your goal when betting the flop is to take down the pot right there or to build a pot so that when you do hit your hand, you get some value for it....

Whether to continue on turn is somewhat dependent on which villain calls you down. If turn is a brick, they check, now you can always take a free card to see river.
Would you do this OOP too?
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07-02-2014 , 02:09 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Olaff
Bolded. That assumes turn is checked to us. What if we brick turn and someone leads into us?
Depends on the player, the card (esp. FD comes or prospect of four-card straight) and the math. But if your image is TAG, this should not happen very much at all.
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07-02-2014 , 10:37 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Olaff
Would you do this OOP too?
?
You wouldn't donk this flop
They're telling you to bet because you have position and it checked to you.
OOP this is a check/call
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07-03-2014 , 01:44 AM
this isnt such an auto bet otf like everyone seems to think where we have two opponents in the blinds that have yet to say anything about the strength of their hand since they're just checking to the PFR. A lot depends on their pre flop calling range and tendencies post flop. Getting c/r would also be pretty unfortunate.

But there is still plenty of merit to betting flop w good equity and potential barrel spots
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