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4! pot JJ QJTQQ

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06-30-2023 , 05:20 PM

DumbosTrunk

Verified Coach PLO5

Join Date: Apr 2017 Posts: 7,331

Hi all,

2/5, V is good pro and opens to $20 in the co, hero 3! JJ btn to $65 $900 eff., V 4! to $140, hero calls.

Flop ($285): QJTcc. V $90, hero calls.

Turn ($465): Qc. V checks, hero checks for deception. Obviously betting is standard and fine but I wanted to get paid by this guy and I think he folds a lot of his range here and I'm more likely to get one street out of him if I feign weakness.

River: Qh. Get a pretty bad river, our hand is basially as strong as AJ now and loses to AA/KK but still beats bluffs. V bets $175.

Thanks,
DT

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06-30-2023 , 11:57 PM

411Heelhook

grinder

Join Date: Aug 2021 Posts: 561

Half pot turn obv. As played if he's a good pro prob stuck having to call, getting too good of a price. One of those spots where you can make an exploitative fold vs a lot of the population because they won't be bluffing nearly enough.

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07-01-2023 , 12:46 AM

illiterat

veteran

Join Date: Mar 2011 Posts: 2,485

I mean there's good pro. and there's having a good bluffing range on this river for less than half pot with a 4bet pre. range.

It feels like it's so often AA/KK/AQs/KQs and almost never like AK/Ac5c that turns itself into a great bluff (esp. for this sizing).

I think the turn check is FPS, but if you did it because you think V is going to way overbluff a lot of rivers then I guess you can sigh call. But if you did it because you thought he'd sigh call 1/2 pot on brick rivers with value hands but would fold turn (seems sus reasoning) then I guess still fold.

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07-01-2023 , 04:55 AM

javi

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Apr 2008 Posts: 8,233

V is a good pro who minraise 4bets OOP vs BTN? does not compute

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07-01-2023 , 01:11 PM

johnnyBuz

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Sep 2013 Posts: 7,563

just bet the freaking turn

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07-02-2023 , 02:18 AM

Slap My Jack

veteran

Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 3,158

If they're a good pro, then I think trying to go too hard exploitatively to extract value can be a bad choice if you're frequently in this player pool. You probably don't even have to bet huge here either, which allows them to peel a large portion of their range, applies pressure, and allows them to checkraise with things you beat.

3bet seems slightly too small at this stack depth.

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07-02-2023 , 04:30 AM

Mlark

old hand

Join Date: Dec 2022 Posts: 1,689

Ugh, just call river as we are getting a good price.

Losing to a royal as well as AA, KK, AQ, KQ. So 13 of the 16 main value 4bets (AA, KK, AKs), and a good amount of the 4bet bluffs that have a Q. We still beat AKo, I guess.

Turn should be a bet, but probably not a huge EV loss.

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07-02-2023 , 02:55 PM

donkatruck

old hand

Join Date: Jan 2013 Posts: 1,911

We lose to AcKc, AA, KK, AQ, KQ. We beat, AK not AcKc and TT. I'm not sure how often we see 4-bets with KQ or TT or any other holding not listed. Its $175 to win $800 I think. I'm thinking folding or calling can't be terrible but probably folding is best. Only hand I see V "bluffing" with is AKo.

Would rather see betting turn.

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