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33 in the CO 33 in the CO

06-13-2012 , 09:00 AM
I've only been at the table for 20 minutes, maybe less, so any read would only be on 'looks like this type'.
1/2, seems a bit loose, 3-5 players per flop, no 3 bets seen so far from anyone pre or post.
Hero has ~225$, table covers or is equal to

3 limps, hero limps from button -1, villain makes it 7$ to play
all folds to hero, I call

flop comes 245 rainbow
hero checks, (with the intention of check raising?)
villain bets 8, hero:

My thoughts are, I like the flop, it is about as good as I can ask for without actually hitting a set. But I don't really know if I want to play out the hand for more streets, any broadway card makes this hard to play OOP
How much should I bet here / should I have led out?
33 in the CO Quote
06-13-2012 , 09:06 AM
What's your hand?
66?

Last edited by Rusty Bumwaters; 06-13-2012 at 09:14 AM. Reason: oh yeah it's in the tittle
33 in the CO Quote
06-13-2012 , 09:14 AM
Checkraise works, this is a board unlikely to hit him so you'll take it down a lot and you have good outs if he sticks around. Make it $35.
33 in the CO Quote
06-13-2012 , 09:28 AM
Okay so he prob doesn't have a big pair given the small raise pf and the small cbet. He could have a middling pair like 66-TT, weighted toward 88+...and of course he could have two big cards like AK-AT, KQ, JTs, QTs, KTs, K9s, maybe T9s...hands along those lines

If we lead at the flop we figure to almost always get called by AT+ since he has a gutshot and 2 overs and 66+ since this is an overpair. He may even call with just 2 overs like KQ. If we c/r we'll fold out maybe 60% of his AT+ hands and he'll draw the other 40% of the time. He'll hardly ever fold 66+ so we're getting called by those also. His other misc big card hands should fold.

Seems like a decent place to make a c/r semi-bluff type play. You can easily rep a set or middle pair if he happens to be concerned about what you're repping and you don't allow him a 2 cheap cards by calling and letting it go check/check ott...plus you charge his AT+ overcard/gutshot hands when he decides to call.

I like making it $35 to go also, that's a bet of $27 into a pot of now $39. Enough to make him fold AT+ and other overcard hands w/o a gutshot and charge him the times he decides to draw with AT+

I'd like to see a turn after the c/r that could get tricky
33 in the CO Quote
06-13-2012 , 09:36 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by JKratzer
Checkraise works, this is a board unlikely to hit him so you'll take it down a lot and you have good outs if he sticks around. Make it $35.
I think we should make the sizing smaller, maybe around 25. If villain 3bets us then he most likely has an overpair and we should be done with this hand so this allows us to get out a little cheaper.
33 in the CO Quote
06-13-2012 , 09:46 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by TAOxEaglex
I think we should make the sizing smaller, maybe around 25. If villain 3bets us then he most likely has an overpair and we should be done with this hand so this allows us to get out a little cheaper.
It also gives him more enticing odds to draw with a gutshot+2 overs

And I think it's likely he'll only call with an overpair being scared of a set if he's the typical passive player
33 in the CO Quote
06-13-2012 , 12:23 PM
Wow, I wouldn't exactly call this a loose table. This seems like an incredibly small raise after 4 limpers, and yet somehow this ends up HU. I also call preflop.

We're getting almost 4:1 on the flop bet. Our implied odds ain't exactly great due to putting 4 to a straight on board. Plus our set outs ain't clean. But it's also possible we might have the best hand that could get checked down. I think all this combined is enough for a call. I would never check/raise here against an unknown as we really have no clue what he does in specific cases.

GcluelessNLnoobG
33 in the CO Quote
06-13-2012 , 12:43 PM
This is highly villain dependent, and we have a villain here we know nothing about. At first his range may seem like 66+/any 2 face cards, but IME here the average player will limp along with(I assume villain is on the button) KT/QJ/AJ/AT type hands and will raise (small) with 66-JJ/AK/AQ.

On flop avg villain(who on avg is not a good player) will not lay down to a check raise w/~any overpair here, especially in position. Even w/AK they will call checkraise too often. So our checkraise pretty much represents a set, which is hard to do.

I just call his bet on flop and see turn. Check raise on turn would be way more effective here than on flop(I'm not saying to necessarily c/r turn)
33 in the CO Quote
06-13-2012 , 01:09 PM
I like a call here.

No info on the opponent and we ~40% to make our hand by the river. I'd eliminate 66 here and count the two remaining 3s as good.

Folding is out based on our equity.

Raising re-opens betting and gives an unknown villain a chance to 3-bet our nice equity out. Our raise likely represents a set which means we lead on all turns if called, most of which are a miss.
33 in the CO Quote
06-13-2012 , 01:15 PM
im raising pre.

Otf if you choose to check rise, make it 25.


Now if this was me, hand goes OTF, flat call. not enough information on villain to c/r.
33 in the CO Quote
06-13-2012 , 02:31 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by samo
I'd eliminate 66 here and count the two remaining 3s as good.
Note that a 3 completes the wheel Ax straight.
33 in the CO Quote
06-13-2012 , 02:45 PM
I am trying to understand the reasoning for a check raise?

He most likely has Ace high which you definitely want him to hit on the turn so that you can stack him.

Just call the flop bet and pray for an Ace or for anyone of the board cards to pair and you should still be good. Another 3 is NOT the card you are looking for in this spot.
33 in the CO Quote
06-13-2012 , 03:28 PM
Yea, I agree with flatting. A) What do you do if he 4 bets? (rhetorical for sure) B) you have a golden opportunity to stack him if things go just right.
33 in the CO Quote
06-14-2012 , 12:07 AM
his 7 dollar raise pre flop is probably some ttpe of sc, or small to mid pair

because of this you probably do not have 10 outs

if the raiser for sure has an over pair you could easily play for stacks in this situation wth 40% equity

however, i woudl for sure c/r

and reeval on the turn if he calls
33 in the CO Quote

      
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