Villain 1 ($1500): Has been running well, bets with his made hands, is really in the mood to call me down, but has not gotten to showdown in about 8 hours without a made hand. Since accumulation of massive stack, he has played pretty loose pre, I’d guess playing 75% of his hands. Post-flop he will call a bit, but rarely bluffs or continues without hands.

Villain 2 ($200): ~60yr old female player who is here for fun. Said this is her relaxing time. She has bought in a few times, pretty tight-passive.

Hero ($700): 21 yr old at table with avg age >40 at the moment. I’m being active but haven’t done (at least shown) anything crazy. I am playing LAG and doing all right with it at the moment. V1 and I have some history but mainly have avoided each other as table has been weak/soft for past few hours.

Preflop: UTG limps, V1 raises in HJ to $12 (std for him), Hero calls with 33 OTB, V2 calls out of BB, UTG folds.

Comments: All seems standard. I think V1 raises exceedingly wide here for a 1/2 45 year old. 55+/AT+/KJs+/KQo+ at least, some SCs too, maybe some random hands. V2 calling is odd for sure, she’s been tight pre all day.

Flop ($38): 937
V2 checks, V1 checks, Hero bets $21.

Comments: V1 has c/r his made hands a ton today, usually to absurd amounts (10 to 110, 25 to 125, etc). I bet to keep V1 in with single pairs, draws, maybe AK/AQ, but also to allow myself options if I get c/r. If I get c/r here, villain has AA/KK/top 2/set ~90%, with other 10% being exclusively 8T.

V2 calls, V1 takes a moment and calls.

Turn ($101): 3

V2 checks, V1 checks, Hero…

Arguments for both exist, I wanted to hear independent views.

Checking lets them catch up, without betting here, I can't play for stacks with the deep guy.

I bet, but not to much where they can still be priced to draw.

I say we bet 30 here, looks like a weak bet as well, someone might come over the top of you.

Playing for stacks with deep guy >>>> everything else, IMO. Plus he never folds a hand that could turn into a BBJ here (a consideration always worth thinking about, IMO). I 1/2 pot it.

GcluelessNLnoobG

Bet. All you are going to get by checking is maybe a bluff on the river, or a small bet that will be the same size as what you would have done on the turn. An over pair may call your turn bet. It seems like the villains want to call, so give them a chance to call your bets.

Many people will advocate the slow play. But why try to trick the people having fun? If you bet and beat them they will say, 'well that serves me right.' If you trick them then it will turn them off. I leave slow playing, and tricks, for regulars.

Mohegun Sun has no BBJ, only High Hand, HHJ.

bet 50

Bet at least half pot here. the turn just brought a flush draw as well as the straight draw that was there on the flop. you need to get some money in the pot. just about everything that called you on the flop is calling you on that turn since the bottom card pairing looks like a safe card.

+1

Except id prolly bet something like 42 to encourage draws.

Bet anywhere between 21 and 60.

Unfortunately it really looks like villain 1 has overcards or a pair lower than 9.

Giving ourselves as much chance as possible to get stacks in with villain 1 definitely trumps all other considerations. If he's scared away by a bet then we were probably never going to win a big pot anyway.

WTF is with people suggesting to bet small lol. We have 700 and are covered, we want to be getting stacks in or at least building pot size so that our river bet is proportionally larger. 75-90 OTT IMO.

Btw you should have bet 25 or 30 on flop. WTF is with terrible advice in LLSNL lately.

Bet $75.

+1
Definitely lean more towards a PSB here. It looks more like you're trying to take the pot down here and V1 will still at least call with OP and reraise with his monsters here

they are not playin an overpair so passively.

they has doodoo and dont wana pay alot

chek, give them a chance to bluff river or at least allow them to intepret that weakness as "oh, my A7 might be good here"

ur not guna get his stack neway, ur 350BB deep and there was no raising up to the turn

might as well go for the strongest part of villains value range and bet big. people are saying he has nothing or villain is weak, if so then ur probably not getting much more anyways. say he has some sort of weirdly played tp/overpair/set, then you want to target those hands here more than his ak/aq/88 type hands. and whats up with everyone doing these weird ass $21 bets and stuff. just throw 5 nickels in and they will still call. on the turn i bet 60-70 and bomb the river.

Definitely should've bet more on the flop. No need to balance your c-bet and value bet ranges on the flop at 1/2. Flop bet is the foundation for the entire pot. It doesn't look like you're going to win a lot this hand unless you have a sweet image so make the money where you'll most likely get called.

$40 or $45 looks good

Bet 30 on the flop and then you can bet 75 into 128 on the turn.

As played, bet 60. 75 would probably be seen as too big in relation to your 21 OTF.
With 60, check raise with a call between will still probably have go to 250ish. Without the call maybe 200ish or even + because of V1's previous big check raises. Either of these situations will get you much closer to playing for stacks OTR.

If one or both call, you may have a chance to raise over a blocker bet or what they think is a value bet of a slowplayed hand. If they check to you tank pot the river and your line can still look like a three barrel bluff IP or an overplayed 1010 JJ, which hopefully they beat.

My image on the table at my casino is that I am loose and I can bet a hand such as 8T/JT (Straight draw) and 3x (bottom pair) in position both on the flop and turn and therefore I bet the flop and on the turn I bet big for two reasons:
1. My image is that I don't only have the nuts with that three. I can aswell bet 9x/7x in position if they have checked to me as well as any reasonable draw.
2. (Most important) we started the hand with 700 and I want to get as much in.

If we check and induce a bluff from a player we might get some value but that is, according to me, just loosing a **** load of value. You also wrote that V1 "is really in the mood to call me down" and that V2 is a passive player (i.e. will not bluff that often but will call down a sweet turn and maybe a river bet?) therefore we should make it big. In reality we want V1 to get as much money in as possible and if he is in a mood to call you down why don't let him think you are bluffing by betting big and let him hero call with a stupid hand or even call for a draw "incorrectly"?

I want to make the bet bigger than 60, more like 70, so that V1 can think that he will get paid of if he hits his draw as it doesn't seem that he has a made hand, according to your comments.

Bet OTT $75 in green chips (if you're non-east coast, then whatever color $25's are) if you can (looks smaller, V's tend to call large-chip bets more easily fwiw). I wouldn't weak-bet to induce because at LLSNL you need to get value from V's tendency to call down with worse, not play back at you light.

Also - you said your image is LAG - you *never* have a 3 in this spot, let alone 2 of them, in V's mind - all the terrible slowplay advice is what typical live V's expect you to do with quads because it's what *they* would do.

Even if you get only one caller OTT it sets up a nice $250 PSB OTR, and you can overshove any 9/7 and expect either V to Zeebo themself. Because of your image, you'll get called down with any overpair TT-QQ, even 88, if the river bricks.

Bottom line is YOU NEED TO BUILD THE POT IMMEDIATELY SO SHOVEL MONEY IN OTT AND MAKE IT LOOK FISHY lolslowplaying.

fwiw I bet 45 i think and got two folds.

Betting was the only was I could play for stacks with my $700 stack and I think that's the best line. Was curious to hear arguments for folding.

Ha, and I thought I was MUBSy...



Gcheck/foldingthisturnandwaitingforbetterspotsG

huh?

You wanted to hear arguments for *folding* the turn... I'm guessing you meant *checking*.

I bet around $60 here. You're encouraging both hands to call since if they had 1 pair hands on the flop, the turn didn't really change anything. They're still calling with their 9x or draws if they have T8.

What is important here is betting so you can play for stacks and also to make a bet that will prevent TP from folding. You have the absolute nuts so you don't want a 1 pair hand to fold.

Also I've found in live poker and ppl will convince themselves that if they called a big bet on the turn, they need to call the river if they still have TP. They'll go into the rational that "I have top pair, no way I can fold".

i mean i sure would like to bet and build a pot to win a large one off V1 but sometimes you gotta think about getting the max value from your made hands and taking lines that will help maximize your profit. With this being multiway and the possibility of Villians donking into us on the river and us having absolute position, i like a disinterested checkback on the turn to make it look like we were stabbing at the pot on the flop which will hopefully induce a bet on the river from either villian. Also hopefully villians make a stupid gutshot and pay off a river raise.

check itbackkk

im not saying its a clear check though, as i usually have a lagtarded image and usually barrell my whole range on all board types.