villain is an older man, maybe 60 years old, but does not seem to be an old nit. more like someone who came to play. has been limp/calling a good bit. the table just opened up and we've been playing for less than one down.

the only other hand i voluntarily played was 3betting AKo after a pfr and a call. every one folded.

villain is bb - ~$400
hero is co - $550, dealt A7

2 few limpers, hero raises to $30, villain calls. one limper calls.

flop: $100, 3 players.
A 8 9
check, check, hero bets $60, villain calls. limper folds.

turn: $220, HU.
7
check, hero bets $125, villain ships for around $200 on top.

hero?

i'm really only worried about JT. i think villain can also do this with any 2p, AX, AT+, etc.

i don't understand the logic, but i see fish spazz out when the board gets scary and jam with weak-ish hand for "protection" (???) fairly regularly.

getting 2.5 to 1 on a call, need about 29%. pretty sure you have that vs that range, especially if you add in naked aces

Call.

How are 88/99 not part of that range? Do we really expect limp/call types to be shoving AJ in this spot? Do you think he calls $60 OTF with 97/87? I think his range may be a tad stronger than you give him credit for. That said, I think this is still a thin call.

220 on the turn + 250 from the bet and call + 200 more from the shove = 670.

670 in the pot and 200 to call is 6.7:2 or 3.35:1 which means we need only 23% equity.



And tightening the range up a little bit gives us:



So if you think his range is tighter than 99-77,AKo-A7o,JTo,AKs-A7s,JTs, then you should fold. I think his range is looser than that and it's so close anyway. Even if you take the AK-ATo out of his range you have 17% equity, just 5% less than you need.

totally agree. the range i mentioned in the OP was a range of hands we are good against but that could still conceivably make this play. probably should have made that more clear.

fold

only hand i feel you can beat is 98, but i feel that he would raise you on the flop with that (I ALWAYS raise bottom two pair, as do any competent players)

personally it feels like a set of 8's or 9's

Just because you don't beat much of his range doesn't mean you should fold.

You have to consider your equity when you're behind and the odds that the pot is offering you. In this case, the odds are really good so even though you are rarely ahead and don't have the type of equity a flush draw would give you, it's still close and requires more consideration than just "You are almost always behind here, fold."

6:1 on the river and his odds to improve are what 10:1?

all hero can beat is a bluff or 8-9 which is highly unlikely like .1% likely

sigh fold

You think this is an unreasonable range for villain?: 99-77,ATo-A7o,JTo,ATs-A7s,JTs

What hands would you remove/add?

Against that range (which I think is way too tight) we have 19% equity.

Add 89s and we are at 22.5% equity. Add 89o and we are at 31%. Add AK and we are at 36%.

Maybe the games we play are very different. The 2/5 game I play, against an average player I see a range much wider than what I've just mentioned.

Limp along preflop IMO.

Check behind flop to get two streets turn/river is slightly better than betting IMO, although with two players its close.

As played I call since worse hands can do this for value once in a while.

What do we put villian on? He limp calls, then calls, then check shoves. Sounds like a strong line but tough to fold 2 pair. Old players are usually huge nits that dont play without huge hands but then again i see them misplay big aces AQ/AK limp callin often. Tough spot. Id probably call because there is so much out there.

why wouldn't we want to iso in position with a suited ace rather than seeing a flop 5+ handed? i think seeing a flop with A7s 5+ ways means we are almost always folding unless we flop 2p+ or the FD.

I definitely prefer a raise from c/o with A7s in this sort of game. And, I'm only checking flop if I believe Villains will attempt to bluff turn or call you down with mid-pair. However, you flopped well, with two-back door draws, so c-bet is optimal IMO.

I don't like this spot on the Turn for most of the reasons stated above. Also, some combo draws are already ahead (56 ahead j10 ahead q10not likely to float flop; you do beat A2-6 though).

You're against tight-range, so fold, especially given your description of Villain, and the fact that none of your outs are clean.

A few reasons IMO:

- You don't dominate his calling range and frequently will be dominated by his range
- People like him will call c-bets a fair % of the time, so unless you have a solid read on his post-flop game I think this will be at best marginal post-flop.
- Axs IP is a perfect hand to see a cheap, high-SPR flop. You will be able to make good decisions throughout, and will frequently make opponents make mistakes on expensive streets.
- Your hand dominates everyone's limping range and while flush/flush is unlikely you will likely stack someone for a very small initial investment.

I think if you had a read on the guy that he l/c wide and then plays fit/fold post-flop then iso-ing is fine. Without that read I think it's just blind aggression with a hand that plays really well multi-way and in position. Just my 2c, most people will reply with stuff about being aggressive, initiative, etc. I think they will be mis-applying these concepts here without specific reads.

I seriously had to go back and re-read the OP like four times to make sure I wasn't crazy.

VILLAIN IS THE BIG BLIND

He did not limp call, he was the first caller in from the bb, which gives him a considerably tighter range. Rule out all versions of 98 and probably A8o/A9o.

WTF call

AT and backdoor diamond draws aren't hands that old man would be check-raising. Most old men would actually be check-calling, even though half of their chips are invested, or open shove on turn.

Old men with A8 and A9 are raising the flop because he's afraid that you might suck out with your AK.

I can't see much other than set and straight in villain's range...maybe a weird 87 of clubs and that's about the only hand I can see that hero is ahead of.

Setsy's post about limping behind nails this. Plus fold as played. No way he's doing this with AJ AQ. This is a straight or set 90%. Unless he is a real fish which isn't what you described.

thanks for the replies...

after villain c/rai, i think for a few seconds and shrug call. villain does not insta-table his hand, so i take this to be a good sign.

river is 6d ... no way i'm good now, if i was before.

Then your read on him is wrong. He's just normal terribad live fish I play against all the time, that will jam any Ace or overpaid as soon as the board gets scary.

i didn't give any read that would suggest he isn't a total fish. i don't recognize him. i've played 10-15 hands max with him.

i said it appears that he "came to play" ie: not to fold... aka: gambly / call station. limp calls a lot... that sounds pretty fishy to me.

My bad. I,misinterpreted your 'came to play' as him being an OK player