2/5

V1- very loose passive and playing fit or fold post flop. Limp/calling a ton. And then check-folding flop a lot. Also has called flop a few times only to fold to a double barrel.

V2- very loose and aggressive. VPIP ~70% and he's raising like 50% pre. He calls very wide OTF (any pair or draw to include gutshots). He has a fold button, but not afraid to make massive bluffs. He's the type that makes a lot of his mistakes aggressively (he isn't going to let you go to value town and call it off). He's been running well and getting paid off by other regs who know his tendencies.

Hero- very card dead in a great game which is making me a bit frustrated. Basically just sitting there and folding a ton. Shows down 1 hand where I had QQ, but no other interesting hands to give anyone any reads except that maybe I'm tight.

V1~150
V2 covers
Hero~515

V1 limps EP, 1 more limp, V2 limps in the CO, hero raise 20 w/ Q5 on the button, both V's call
Flop (~65) QT7
2 checks, hero bets 35, both call
Turn (~165) 7
2 checks, hero bets 90, 1 fold, V2 puts me all in for 370 more hero?

I bet the turn because I was fine getting it in with V1 since I didn't put him on a Q, because I thought he'd either put it in on the flop or lead turn after V2 called. And V2 doesn't have many Q's in his range after l/calling pre and then over calling the flop. 7x is def in his range.

I know, fold pre. But I effectively have AA here due to him being so polarized in this spot.

I took a very similar line on Weds night against a table full of folks with whom I have lots of history.

Similar flop, QJ5r.

V x/s OTT. I called and saw 2nd-pair-no-kicker, which is exactly what I expected. MHIG.

If you have a read on V, then go with the read.

I've called V down with marginal holdings before and also did later in the session, I guess my question is: since the 7 pairs the turn And 7x makes a ton of sense for his passive pre/ overcall flop/ then c/r turn line, can we find a fold in this specific spot? Or do we stick to our read that he's always going to have enough bluffs in his range that we can't fold anything decent?

Did Villain think for a while before calling the flop? I'd think he'd at least think about raising a draw, especially if he's going to raise it once the board pairs.

We also have the dead bottom of our value range (in fact, I have NFI why we even have this hand in our PFR range; we're allowed to overlimp), his raise is quite large (so we don't need to defend often), and he reps stuff, so I probably just give it to him. Also, I probably check if I think V2 is going to mostly raise his draws.

The best way to exploit LAGs is to not overplay marginal hands on early streets so that we can show up with the goods proportionally more often when the pot gets big. Even checking back the flop and raise/GII on safe turns seems like a better exploitation plan than overrepping our hand and then stacking off with it.

There has got to be a better opportunity to exploit this guy.

He called fairly quickly on the flop, and given his playing style I kind of discounted 2pr and big draws on the flop.

And normally I don't raise this hand but raised somewhat out of frustration from not being able to pick up a hand in a game where ppl were giving away money. But, I was going to the flop with V1 who is going to play super straightforward and V2 who has a very weak limping range so I still think it's +ev.

My flop bet was 100% for value because V2 will call with Tx and 7x and doesn't really have Qx in his limping range. I'm fine with the flop but I think I could check back the turn and try to pick off a bluff OTR that will be much smaller than the bet I ended up facing.

Without a read, this is a simple fold (b/f is a bit optimistic).

If you have a read, go with your read.

In my hand, I had a rock solid read, based on many hours of history.

YMMV

Yeah, fold pre and check turn.

Since you're in this spot, you almost have to call the turn shove. You're crushed by 7x, QJ+, and boats. You're crushing Tx. And have anywhere from 60%-75% equity vs. draws, let's just say 70%. We can weight 7x combos a little less with two 7s on the board. You only need 31% equity to call. Seems like a pretty clear call vs. described villain.

You can get yourself in much better positions than this. Q5s is pretty garbage against 3 limpers plus blinds yet to act.

I disagree with this.

The best way to exploit a LAG is to make them put $$$ into the pot, even if you have a marginal hand.

Checking back the flop against a LAG is bad, IMO. A LAG is going to have a wide range and will be likely calling your cbet very wide.

If you are going to squeeze on the button with Q5s, then you need to bet at least $30. If everyone folds, great. We just picked up $22.

As played, it's either b/f or check turn/bluff catch river.

I'll first say that I wasn't necessarily endorsing a flop check back here (though I think that can be a good play) as I was illustrating that limping/checking back any of the first 3 streets is better than raise/betting all three.

Exploiting loose-passive stations is very different from exploiting lags. He's not going to play super straight forward and just x/c down three streets with worse hands and kindly alert us to the fact that he has a better hand whenever he does. We're preparing for war, and we're entering the fight with a pretty raggy hand. We've hit literally the best flop possible short of the 3% of the time we flop two pair or trips, and still everything we do from this point forward is going to be pretty marginal.

Whether villain's flop peel range or turn blast when flop is checked through range is wider is dependent on the type of lag. Is the loose part of this player the bigger leak, or is the aggressive part? In other words, are they chk/calling more or betting more? If you cbet the flop, then surely he's not calling with a black 65, but if you check it, he might very well lead with that. If we check back flop and raise him on a black 2, isn't he gonna think his FE is massive and shove it in, whereas it'd be a bit silly for him to x/r the flop and then bluff-call it all off when we rep every Q+ in the universe. You also allow your equity to spike way up before you commit a bunch of money to the pot.

In other words, we're trying to exploit his aggression more-so than his looseness.

Again, not that checking back the flop is absolutely positively the best play, but making it so that villain doesn't have betting initiative on any single street in the hand is a mistake ... a mistake we can't afford to make when we have a hand that's *barely* ahead of his range.

Adjusting your btn opens this far down is probably fine. Flop bet/size is fine. Once they both call flop, I ck back turn > betting since tpnk cannot comfortably withstand ck-r from V2 nor a call/raise from V1, nor any combination of both. It's tempting to bet a board this wet for some value and prot, but pot control seems to outweigh all options.

If you have to bet, size up - enough to fold V1 Stronger Qx while thinly getting value from V2 draws and making a call off easier to swallow ... Bet 125-140 works a bit better but you're also only betting if snapping off a shove from V2. The hand is obv over if V1 continues, but you could get folds from both a lot as well which is great.