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2/5 Line check:T9o from CO vs Monkey Tilt V in SB 2/5 Line check:T9o from CO vs Monkey Tilt V in SB

07-22-2016 , 11:49 PM
Villain is MAAG, some history. Definitely plays for action. Gets felted 2-3 times per night, and will rebuy with odd amounts. Sometimes $500, sometimes $200, $245, etc. Nothing terribly consistent about his play, but he does play at extremes. He'll play uber-nit for 30-45 minutes, then aggro LAG for 10-15 minutes.

Villain has just lost an AI from the BB with AK rivered TPTK vs turned two pair, still cussing as he puts $200 cash on the table. Chip runner hasn't arrived as next hand is dealt.

Pot folds around to Hero in CO.

Hero ($650): T9 Raises to $25.
Fold
Fold
V SB ($200): call.

Flop: T43

V donks $75
Hero shoves.

Spew?
2/5 Line check:T9o from CO vs Monkey Tilt V in SB Quote
07-23-2016 , 12:28 AM
I'd rather just call him down
2/5 Line check:T9o from CO vs Monkey Tilt V in SB Quote
07-23-2016 , 02:57 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ranma4703
I'd rather just call him down
This. Guy is probably blasting with any piece, gutshot bottom pair or whatever he catched and by raising flop you give him reasons to fold.

You have position- just call and let him put in the rest on the turn.

That being said i dont like the preflopraise at all. 10-9 off just isnt the hand i want to involve myself with against a villain in the blinds on monkeytilt.

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2/5 Line check:T9o from CO vs Monkey Tilt V in SB Quote
07-23-2016 , 08:21 AM
Pre is pretty bad imo
flop is a fine shove
He's not folding any pair vs a shove anyway, and if we get him to lay down ahigh gshots or random nonsene hands like qj, thats very good. He only needs 25% equity to call off a shove, he might easily make an equity mistake by folding
2/5 Line check:T9o from CO vs Monkey Tilt V in SB Quote
07-23-2016 , 09:53 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by sauhund
Pre is pretty bad imo
flop is a fine shove
He's not folding any pair vs a shove anyway, and if we get him to lay down ahigh gshots or random nonsene hands like qj, thats very good. He only needs 25% equity to call off a shove, he might easily make an equity mistake by folding
Not really good if we get him to fold gutshots or A high. These hands only has 4 outs for the gutshot and 3 outs for A high low kicker.

We want him in the hand with these hands and give him the turncard he is extremely likely to pile in the rest. If he against all odds slows down on the turn we have pos, and can go allin ourself and that way make sure that it doesent go check-check.

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2/5 Line check:T9o from CO vs Monkey Tilt V in SB Quote
07-23-2016 , 10:04 AM
This is really a 'feel' thing.... and it's hard to bring a strategic decision making process to it... guess it just depends on how tilted our man is. All you know for sure is that he likely doesn't have a terribly strong hand... probably capped at AT - but more skewed to hands you beat I imagine. So, since we aren't going to fold - we might as well target hands that we beat to get max value. It feels to me that there's almost no chance that he folds after getting half his stack in... so might as well shove.

But, really... why get involved in the first place. Fold pre.
2/5 Line check:T9o from CO vs Monkey Tilt V in SB Quote
07-23-2016 , 10:12 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by jake
This is really a 'feel' thing.... and it's hard to bring a strategic decision making process to it... guess it just depends on how tilted our man is. All you know for sure is that he likely doesn't have a terribly strong hand... probably capped at AT - but more skewed to hands you beat I imagine. So, since we aren't going to fold - we might as well target hands that we beat to get max value. It feels to me that there's almost no chance that he folds after getting half his stack in... so might as well shove.

But, really... why get involved in the first place. Fold pre.

1) I go by the definition and description OP provided in the headline: wich says villain is on monkeytilt. So if we trust OPs description (wich we have to i suppose, we werent at the table ourself), villains range is superwide at this point and very likely has a decent amount of air in it wich we want in the hand. Cliffs: if we raise villain have to fold his air, wich we of course dont want.

2) No, its not really a feel thing either. Villain clearly is on huge tilt and is blasting money into the pot. We have top pair on this board, wich is likely to be well ahead of villains range at this point. We have position and should be smart enough to utilize that by just calling to make sure we get the rest of tilted monkeys money on the turn.

This is the core concept of exploitation: how is this villain most likely to put money into the pot?My bet is that a tilted villain like OP describes is most likely to stackoff if he can drive the action, and he can be allowed to do the betting.

The guy wants to put money in the pot: all we have to do is to allow him to do so.
2/5 Line check:T9o from CO vs Monkey Tilt V in SB Quote
07-23-2016 , 10:23 AM
Everything I would have said has already been said, but this is a call on the flop and a clear fold pre, *especially* when villain only has $200 behind. If you're going to target this type of player with a speculative hand, you at least should have better implied odds to do so.
2/5 Line check:T9o from CO vs Monkey Tilt V in SB Quote
07-23-2016 , 10:28 AM
pre I'd go $15 or fold
shove is good, if you're not gii here, pre was a huge mistake
2/5 Line check:T9o from CO vs Monkey Tilt V in SB Quote
07-23-2016 , 10:36 AM
FWIW i get that OP probably ran into a rare monster here and got stacked- and thats why this thread is excisting.

But resultsoriented thinking isnt my thing, so i provide my answers like i havent any clue about results in this hand.
2/5 Line check:T9o from CO vs Monkey Tilt V in SB Quote
07-23-2016 , 11:08 AM
nice live poker play
2/5 Line check:T9o from CO vs Monkey Tilt V in SB Quote
07-23-2016 , 11:49 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gilmour
1) I go by the definition and description OP provided in the headline: wich says villain is on monkeytilt. So if we trust OPs description (wich we have to i suppose, we werent at the table ourself), villains range is superwide at this point and very likely has a decent amount of air in it wich we want in the hand. Cliffs: if we raise villain have to fold his air, wich we of course dont want.

2) No, its not really a feel thing either. Villain clearly is on huge tilt and is blasting money into the pot. We have top pair on this board, wich is likely to be well ahead of villains range at this point. We have position and should be smart enough to utilize that by just calling to make sure we get the rest of tilted monkeys money on the turn.
I'm just saying there are degrees of tilt. I can't recall the number of times a player has made a huge bet/raise after a bad hand and then shown down a decent hand. But... if he really was on monkey tilt - he will almost never fold to a shove here. If he's got a draw, overs, any pair - he's calling.
2/5 Line check:T9o from CO vs Monkey Tilt V in SB Quote
07-23-2016 , 04:07 PM
The problem with flatting the flop is that you aren't strong enough to want to slowplay instead of just protecting your equity. Preflop sizing is lol bad but as played shoving is the only play.


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2/5 Line check:T9o from CO vs Monkey Tilt V in SB Quote
07-23-2016 , 10:58 PM
Regarding the fold pre, my action was table dependents, and I saw this as prime stealing opportunity. This is my regular game, and I'm pretty familiar with 6-7 of the opponents. A fold around to the CO is pretty rare, as this game is typically a l/c fest. When first to enter the pot is a raise, it tends to get more respect. I'm in seat 9 so I'm fairly 'hidden' from that end of the table, with OMC OTB in seat 1. BB is a known villain, does not get fancy OOP, and does not see me a a serial blind thief but knows I'll take advantage when the opportunity arises. I actually didn't expect SB to come along since he didn't even have chips yet and was rebuying so short.

Otherwise, I've got a hand I think is pretty easy to play post if it comes to that.

Quote:
Originally Posted by suited fours
pre I'd go $15 or fold
shove is good, if you're not gii here, pre was a huge mistake
I see the reasoning for $15, but table dynamics would be asking for a multi-way pot, and that wasn't my goal. Definitely a feel thing, but I actually went down to $20 from my standard $25 open. If BB was paying attention, he would notice the different sizing.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gilmour
FWIW i get that OP probably ran into a rare monster here and got stacked- and thats why this thread is excisting.

But resultsoriented thinking isnt my thing, so i provide my answers like i havent any clue about results in this hand.
Quite the opposite.

V snap calls the shove, hero mutters 'well that doesn't bode well'.

Turn J
River 7

V tables 76, MHIG
2/5 Line check:T9o from CO vs Monkey Tilt V in SB Quote
07-24-2016 , 09:04 AM
I actually like it, i think he can show up with any pair A-2,a-5,5-6 type hands, of course he shows up with better often (maybe 30 -40 percent) but vs a spewtard who wants to light money on fire before going home with a bad beat story you have to be willing to gamble.
P.S the bonus equity of him reloading again and again again makes this a clear cut open and shove.
P.P.S. a solid part of your live win rate is knowing when someone wants to give away money and putting yourself in a mediocre ev spot pre to make a bunch post.....rational ranges pre and for the most part post, have nothing to do with true monkey tilt.
2/5 Line check:T9o from CO vs Monkey Tilt V in SB Quote
07-24-2016 , 10:09 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by adam levine
I actually like it, i think he can show up with any pair A-2,a-5,5-6 type hands, of course he shows up with better often (maybe 30 -40 percent) but vs a spewtard who wants to light money on fire before going home with a bad beat story you have to be willing to gamble.
P.S the bonus equity of him reloading again and again again makes this a clear cut open and shove.
P.P.S. a solid part of your live win rate is knowing when someone wants to give away money and putting yourself in a mediocre ev spot pre to make a bunch post.....rational ranges pre and for the most part post, have nothing to do with true monkey tilt.
Couple of excellent points- thanks.

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2/5 Line check:T9o from CO vs Monkey Tilt V in SB Quote

      
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