hero $1.5k - UTG - maybe a tad lag image. young kid. 6/9 players here are playing pretty ABC nitty. villain is not one of them. likes to limp and see flops. below average rec player.

villain ~$950 - button - see above; have not seen too many of his showdowns but he won a huge pot by limping MP with like Th5h or something like that and flopping a flush vs nutflush draw vs flopped set.

v2 utg+1 - $600 - old passive man whining every hand about being card dead

v3 utg+2 - $500 - average rec player. young WG who said hes down a lot from tournament/blackjack

v4 bb - $1k



hero opens UTG with 5c5x to $20
v2 call
v3 call
villain call on button
v4 calls from bb

FWIW at this table i think opening these pp are ok. this is not a table where every raise will go 4-5 way. ive had plenty of hands where i opened, went 2 or 3 way, and took it down with a c-bet so i feel ok opening this and c-betting a lot of diff boards.


Flop (~$95) 9c5h3c
v4 check
Hero bets $60
folds to villain
villain raises to $120
hero calls $120


Turn ($335) As
hero check
villain bets $250
hero x/jam


is flop flat bad? do we always have to be 3b this flop? my plan was to x/j all non-club turns. i havent seen villain raise any flops yet.

nh wp. Flop is not that coordinated - a 3b should fold out almost everything. It's unfortunate that you have the 5c, but whatever.

Agree with whorasaurus. Flatting the flopraise is good at many tables and against many villains when youre getting somewhat deeper stacks. Flatting flop widens your range alot,wich is getting it alot harder for villain to make correct decisions on later streets- and you often get him to fire a sizeable turn barrell with most of his range=printing money/getting fat value.

Also flatting is giving villain the chance to catch a card that is RIO for him, and a card that he can possibly lose alot of money on but he maybe would have folded to flop 3 bet. Lets say if he for example have A9 here, backed into top two on the turn= youre getting maximum value that you woudnt have gotten otherwise. If he buttonclicks flop with a hand like 8-9 suited for top pair, he can catch a 9 or an 8 on the turn wich he obviously will think is the stones cause we flat called flop. He can blast one more barrell into the abyss if he have flushdraw and so on. Alot of good things can potenially happen here.

Nice hand and i like how you played every street.

Should add I'm not really a fan of the preflop raise, but i guess if its a nitfest where nobody is 3betting, its ok

confirmation from you 2 is enough for me to not feel awful about the hand. 3betting was not existent for the most part. felt pretty good in my LAG mode 8)

but in all seriousness, how do we perceive min raises on flops like this vs average/below average rec players? is it optimistic or reasonable to range villain on a hand like A9, TT-JJ ish where they "raise to find out where i am" or "put you on AK."

we would love to keep AcXc in his range, but can we still include this hand in his range? feel like people want more fold equity and would raise bigger, or are happy to just call with NFD on these hands. however, he can maybe be raising, again, because "put you on AK"

Nice hand

Well played.

How would we feel about Hero's line if V checks behind the turn, which probably happens way more often than not?

V's range on the flop raise is likely combo draws, TT-QQ (reasonable that V flats these pre to an UTG open), maybe A9. Very few if any two pair hands in his range. Combo draws that don't improve on the turn will often check behind for a free river. QQ-TT will check behind as well. Really the only part of V's range that will bet this turn is Axcc and 42cc, so I don't think we can really expect him to bet here often enough to c/r.

We're OOP and this turn checking through would be a disaster. I prefer a flop 3bet to keep the initiative (he's not raise/folding to a smallish 3bet on the flop), and lead the turn. AP, I lead this turn anyway.

you think players raise flop and check back turns "way more often" than continue to bet turns? i would have to disagree with that, but i do agree this sucks when it checks back on turn.

however my line may look FOS if i overbet river if he checks back turn.

what hands continue when we 3bet flop?

Yes, I see the raise flop check back turn line more often than you might think - but don't generalize it. Look at this exact flop and think what V might raise it with.

TT-QQ? Sure. A9? Maybe. Two pairs? Sure, if there are any in his range given preflop action, so probably not many. Combo draws? Plenty of those.

Now think about what each portion of that range will do on this turn. Combo draws often raise the flop to attempt to win unimproved against c-betting hands like AK, but once you call their raise they know you likely have a made hand and they have to improve to win, so they can easily take a free river card.

As for what hands continue when you 3bet flop...probably all of them except A9. Maybe he can find a hero fold with TT-QQ but not often, especially if you don't size it big. Most LLSNL villains just don't have raise/fold in their repertoire.

yeah im not too sure if 3bet flop is best or not... and i can see a lot of merits to it. i also see merits to donking turn after his min raise.