2/4 NL min check raised on flop - Live Low-stakes No Limit Poker Forum

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2/4 NL min check raised on flop

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11-07-2010 , 01:49 PM

schlep

adept

Join Date: Feb 2009 Posts: 808

Villian 1 UTG+1($600) Big fish calls raises with J7o got stacked earlier in a limper pot shoving top two to get called by a turned straight.

Villian 2 BB($1000) Looser aggressive, came to the table tilting and bluffing a lot has calmed down after stacking villian 1.

Hero Tight solid($530)4

, called down villian 2 after raising PF cbetting top pair and check calling turn and river against villian 2 and was good.

Villian 1 raises $22
Hero CO calls $22
Villian 2 calls $22

Flop A

Villian 1 checks
Hero bets $46
Villian 2 raises $100
Villian 1 folds
Hero calls $54

Turn 7

Villian 2 bets $180

Last edited by schlep; 11-07-2010 at 02:12 PM.

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11-07-2010 , 01:55 PM

Stoepsel

grinder

Join Date: Mar 2008 Posts: 409

shove if you have T8 (even more when dd), fold if you have 22
in other words: what did you have?

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11-07-2010 , 01:56 PM

masaraksh

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Mar 2010 Posts: 5,250

hero was not dealt into the hand but is calling to float flop c/r and take it away on the turn. stick with the plan, bet 1/2pot.

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11-07-2010 , 02:11 PM

schlep

adept

Join Date: Feb 2009 Posts: 808

haha might be important 4

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11-07-2010 , 02:23 PM

Stoepsel

grinder

Join Date: Mar 2008 Posts: 409

ok, so then big fish raises utg -> i can find a fold without other callers here, fish usually call and dont raise with trash hands.
otf take my freecard, if he calls everything there's enough time to get the money in when you hit.
after the c/r the pot is about 210$ -> 4:1 so i call.
then he bets 180$ in the now 260$ pot -> 2,4:1 with then 230$ behind -> fold, cant make enough even with io
hope the math is right, just made this post besides playing

edit: as said, playing while typing, didnt see the gutshot, but i dont hink it changes much

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11-07-2010 , 02:41 PM

wachtwoord

centurion

Join Date: Jun 2009 Posts: 148

Calling is directly profitable even if we give him a monster range:

Board: Ad 9h 6d 7s

Wins Ties Equity
32.20% 0.00% 32.20% ( 4d5d )
67.80% 0.00% 67.80% ( AA, 99, 66, 77, AK, AQ )

and we need 29% to call pure pot odd-wise. So folding seems out of the question.

So the question whether to call or raise. And that depends how often he is semi-bluffing a hand like 78. If you don't think he'd fold obv call. Online I will ship it here against a lot of villains.

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11-07-2010 , 03:39 PM

mp_all_in

banned

Join Date: Apr 2008 Posts: 680

Quote:

Originally Posted by wachtwoord

wat? hope you're leveling here.

I'm ok with the preflop call in position here on the raiser. Why not check the flop and try to get a free card or call to see the turn for half the price. Or just to see how the action plays out - if V2 bets and V1 check raises then you can get away with only $22 invested. I think it's a little hopeful to try to steal there with the A on board in a raised pot.

The turn is a fold unless you're sure you can get paid on the river. However V2 has to figure you may have a draw here. Second thought...just fold - you don't have enough $$ behind you.

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11-07-2010 , 03:43 PM

Stoepsel

grinder

Join Date: Mar 2008 Posts: 409

mp_all_in: the hh is a little confusing, but if i got it right, hero is co, vil 1 utg1 and vil 2 sb, so both have already checked so hero doesn't have to try but is sure to get the free card. besides that, i can agree with you

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11-07-2010 , 03:52 PM

Jarretman

veteran

Join Date: Jun 2010 Posts: 2,937

Quote:

Originally Posted by wachtwoord

Calling is directly profitable only if we give him a monster range:

Board: Ad 9h 6d 7s

Wins Ties Equity
32.20% 0.00% 32.20% ( 4d5d )
67.80% 0.00% 67.80% ( AA, 99, 66, 77, AK, AQ )

and we need 29% to call pure pot odd-wise. So folding seems out of the question.

So the question whether to call or raise. And that depends how often he is semi-bluffing a hand like 78. If you don't think he'd fold obv call. Online I will ship it here against a lot of villains.

FYP, all of our outs are super scare cards and we won't be getting paid by 1 pair hands.

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11-07-2010 , 04:03 PM

#10

mp_all_in

banned

Join Date: Apr 2008 Posts: 680

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stoepsel

I see what you're saying. I was assuming v2 was the button. I think that's even more reason to take the free card.

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11-07-2010 , 08:02 PM

#11

quesuerte

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Feb 2009 Posts: 4,333

Fold pre

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11-07-2010 , 08:34 PM

#12

masaraksh

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Mar 2010 Posts: 5,250

Quote:

Originally Posted by quesuerte

Fold pre

that response should be banned.

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11-07-2010 , 09:34 PM

#13

venice10

Referee

Join Date: Nov 2007 Posts: 25,887

Quote:

Originally Posted by masaraksh

that response should be banned.

Not in this case.

If Hero was c/r on the flop, it is the easy fold at that point. This hand is a prime example of why calling 54s pf is rarely a great play for our level of play.

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11-07-2010 , 10:04 PM

#14

masaraksh

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Mar 2010 Posts: 5,250

Quote:

Originally Posted by venice10

Not in this case.

If Hero was c/r on the flop, it is the easy fold at that point. This hand is a prime example of why calling 54s pf is rarely a great play for our level of play.

I think its better to bet/3bet the flop against this ******ed check-minraise and commit with the bare FD than to bet/call flop. especially given read that villain bluffs.

I feel like villain maybe clicking it back with air here a bunch just like the fish at 2NL

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11-07-2010 , 10:47 PM

#15

papagavin

old hand

Join Date: Apr 2010 Posts: 1,628

Quote:

Originally Posted by masaraksh

omg masaraksh plays 2nl!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
so much is now clear to me

btw probably fold pre without atleast a few more callers between us and the pfr, from there I'd prob 3b flop because calling is awkward. OTT its just maths.

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11-07-2010 , 11:03 PM

#16

masaraksh

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Mar 2010 Posts: 5,250

Quote:

Originally Posted by papagavin

omg masaraksh plays 2nl!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
so much is now clear to me

btw probably fold pre without atleast a few more callers between us and the pfr, from there I'd prob 3b flop because calling is awkward. OTT its just maths.

lmao...

dude, I can't even beat 2NL are you kidding me. When they check/clickminraise me on the flop i friggin click it back and then call it off with bottom pair. ldo

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11-07-2010 , 11:19 PM

#17

papagavin

old hand

Join Date: Apr 2010 Posts: 1,628

Quote:

Originally Posted by masaraksh

lmao...

dude, I can't even beat 2NL are you kidding me. When they check/clickminraise me on the flop i friggin click it back and then call it off with bottom pair. ldo

isn't bottom pair like the 2nd nuts?

wtf wow online poker is getting so hard when u cant even get bottom pair in for value

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11-07-2010 , 11:32 PM

#18

masaraksh

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Mar 2010 Posts: 5,250

Quote:

Originally Posted by papagavin

isn't bottom pair like the 2nd nuts?

wtf wow online poker is getting so hard when u cant even get bottom pair in for value

i always have kicker problems with my bottoms pairs.

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11-07-2010 , 11:33 PM

#19

MK7749

veteran

Join Date: Sep 2008 Posts: 2,173

hmmmm this is basically a question of math right? basicaly we know we are beat but if we hit we beat everyone of Vils hand.

so the math was done. call.

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11-08-2010 , 12:46 AM

#20

schlep

adept

Join Date: Feb 2009 Posts: 808

I´d rarely say this is a good play to call pre-flop at this level but the table was strong and I would say that villian 1 was the biggest fish at the table. Villian 2 is a strong player that plays 5/10 as well.

Anyone like iso 3betting an UTG+1 raiser that is going to play straightforward postflop?

My image was so tight that I could rep a strong A here, not saying that taking the free card wasn´t the best action but I didn´t think I would be able to steal the pot and rep a hand if I didnt bet the flop to start with.

His bet-sizing on the flop didn´t feel like air so i´m not sure how much equity i would of had against his range by 3betting.

Last edited by schlep; 11-08-2010 at 01:08 AM.

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