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1/3 - Check my thinking with bottom set 1/3 - Check my thinking with bottom set

08-13-2023 , 11:38 AM
Note: most of my experience is online in the the micros, but recently moved to an area where I have access to live cash games, so I'm trying to get better at those. This is my first live HH on this forum

Friday night at the Indy Horseshoe
8 handed
This is my second or third orbit at the table. It is early but if they are paying attention they may noticed I haven't limped a hand which everyone else is doing

V1 in EP covers. He sometimes limps, sometimes raises pre
H in MP has 300
V2 in BTN has ~230. He is limping many hands and I haven't seen him raise pre

Pre: H has 3 3 in MP
EP limps, I limp, CO + BTN + blinds limp
This is one of the few circumstances where I would consider limping - someone else has already limped in, I have a low PP, and I expect to not get raised. Should I have raised or folded?

Flop (6 players): (18) 4 3 8
H bets 15, only BTN and EP call
Should I have overbet?

Turn (3 players): (~60) 4 3 8 Q
H bets 60, BTN calls, EP folds
Hoping to get max value from pairs, two pairs, and FDs. How is this sizing?

River (2 players): (~180): 4 3 8 Q A
H checks, BTN bets 45, Hero shoves (BTN has ~100 behind)
I check hoping to induce a shove from two pairs or a missed FD. I expect 44/88 would have raised flop or turn. QQ and AA I rule out because they would have raised pre or bet larger on river, and QQ would have likely raised turn, so I feel safe getting it in. Thoughts?
1/3 - Check my thinking with bottom set Quote
08-13-2023 , 12:31 PM
If players are passive or not sticky and stacks are bigger I raise. If players are passive and sticky and stacks are smaller are i call. If players are aggressive behind you it gets trickier and any of the three options have merit. If I was in early position I usually fold, but occasionally raise if I think my image is ultra tight, or take the fish line of limp fold if it seems like everyone else is fishy and I need to swim too.

Call preflop seems fine at these depths and only being there a couple orbits. Hand looks like it was played fine. I would have shoved the river but check shove is probably about the same EV live to get him to bet some busted flush draws for $45. And two pair you are more likely to get the money on a shove than check shove. So river is whatever to me. But also realize that when you limp, you are going to get set over set far more often when it goes 6 ways to a flop. You are so shallow I would still shove without thinking, but if you get up to 200bb you need to consider flat calling the river with bottom set in a limped pot.
1/3 - Check my thinking with bottom set Quote
08-13-2023 , 12:56 PM
Looks to be played just about right to me. Sorry you lost rebuy and don't tilt.
1/3 - Check my thinking with bottom set Quote
08-13-2023 , 01:54 PM
Preflop vs one limp I would fold from EP, overlimp HJ-SB and MP would be table dependent but somewhere in between.

Flop and turn are fine but you are obviously very strong. I wonder if a jam gets called by anything apart from a rivered two pair or AXdd. Probably not much in it between a jam and a check
1/3 - Check my thinking with bottom set Quote
08-13-2023 , 04:02 PM
Played well though the river check is risky and I think just shoving is better as most people will play passively especially if you had been play aggressively throughout the hand.

You can limp behind pf because most low stakes live will play passively and you won't get iso'd often enough. Also raising a low pp plays poorly post flop multiway if you don't hit a set so I wouldn't use these hands to Iso limpers.
1/3 - Check my thinking with bottom set Quote
08-13-2023 , 04:23 PM
I would just lead river for his remaining 145ish.
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08-13-2023 , 05:01 PM
Looks fine except I just shove river myself.
1/3 - Check my thinking with bottom set Quote
08-13-2023 , 11:36 PM
Thanks for the feedback everyone, leading the river makes sense

Naturally,

Spoiler:
BTN calls with the AA he limped pre that rivered top set
1/3 - Check my thinking with bottom set Quote
08-14-2023 , 02:03 AM
You played it fine, although you can just jam river.

This is super rare that you run into this. I'd guess less than 5 in 10,000 hands someone limps behind aces in a multiway pot.
1/3 - Check my thinking with bottom set Quote
08-14-2023 , 05:32 AM
Flop: In these low absolute total value pots multiway, I usually want to bet big, and typically pot or over, so I'd probably go 20 or more
River: Just stick it in

Results: Profusely congratulate him on his brilliant play.
1/3 - Check my thinking with bottom set Quote
08-14-2023 , 11:52 AM
Most LLSNL games are fairly raisey preflop (ime), so I think overlimping in MP (depending on how early it is) is a little dicey, but obviously not horrible. Although I would often fold small pairs here.

I'm fine with any ~PSB type bet on the flop.

With two players in the hand it is probably the case that at least one of them is on a draw, so I'm cool with our large turn bet (although it will lose all one pair hands at this point).

River is either/or for me. The Axdd got there (but will check back) so I think shoving outright is fine targetting this sort of hand. However, most of the draws busted, so checking to induce (and shoving over top) is also fine.

A couple places where there are reasons to make different decisions, but I think our line is a perfectly acceptable one.

ETA: Definitely not a result you'd expect that much due to the preflop (lack of) action, but something that you can never rule out in LLSNL. There are a handful of players I play with that have a 0% preflop raising range from all positions. I myself have a ~0% preflop raising range from HJ-, and I've even overlimped the button with monsters if I think the situation is ok for an attempt at it. Just something to keep in mind when you are attempting to range people, although it doesn't really come into play here with this strong a hand / at this stack depth.

GcluelessNLnoobG

Last edited by gobbledygeek; 08-14-2023 at 11:57 AM.
1/3 - Check my thinking with bottom set Quote
08-14-2023 , 12:05 PM
Played well. No issues.
1/3 - Check my thinking with bottom set Quote
08-14-2023 , 03:29 PM
its a small point but id pot or bet 20 otf.

river is an interesting line, im not sure if its better than just betting. i dont see that many non sdv draws that can call the turn when u bomb it is kind of the issue and i dont expect him to bet Ax. like theres what 65dd / hh, 76 dd / hh, 75dd / hh, jtdd, j9dd, t9dd? do we really expect him to peel 60 w k5dd or something w a guy behind? probably not. if hes going to turn a pair + draw into a bluff then by all means i think this is good but i think theres atleast as many axss hands that river top pair that can potetially hero it off. also if he somehow has 2p worse than ax he may check back. i think checking the river is better if turn isnt multiway or if u bet smaller or the more floaty / chasy / peely u have an idea the guy is

expected the bad beat hh to be 52ss not aa lol
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08-15-2023 , 12:45 AM
Lead river.
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