Hero (LAG image, covers table) opens to $10, 2 calls, V (old guy, $900) 3b to $40, Hero calls, BTN calls

Flop ($130): 754sdc
V bets $75, Hero calls, BTN folds

Turn ($280): Jc
V bets $110, Hero calls

River ($500): Ks
V bets $120, Hero folds

Line okay? Should I have bluffraised any street? Didn’t think I could get AA-JJ to fold, but not sure.

What do you have?

GcluelessHHnoobG

Ugh.. A3cc.

P.S. can a mod please edit and add that in OP?

Seems fine to me

Can you give positions. I'm assuming Villain is SB or BB, and you're EP?

Any reads on villain? That's a weirdly small 3bet, with 3 people already in the pot.

I think line is fine. I'm a nit so probably fold this pre in EP, but I don't have any real issues this deep. Normally would not call 3bet, but I think given price it's OK.

As for bluff raising. Definitely not flop where we don't have huge equity and button still to act. Turn/River really are very hero dependent. In a vacuum I'm taking your line, but what do we make of the small river bet? Weak or sucker bet?

easy fold on flop w/ one person behind..............

Fold pre. We're OOP to an absurdly tight range (old guy 3-betting. alarm bells anyone?). As played line was fine.

Pre is fine this deep vs that sizing when 2 others have already put in dead money and are probably calling too. Though it’s pretty marginal and dont hate a fold

All is fine imo but pre could be just an initial fold depending on position. I'm guessing he has QQ based on the "please don't raise me" river sizing and I'm not sure he'll fold.

i think raise turn to like 250, gii river on most runouts flush/straight/A/8/3/etc..

Meh, not really a huge fan of xc that flop without more villain info.

Preflop is pretty meh, imo. Yeah, we're deep and in position. But we have poor IO on A high flops when good (and poor RIO when no good, although I assume we can get away for one bet at worst). Are we really going to make up what we need HU or even multiway (noting we'll be sandwiched between the raiser and whoever comes along behind us, making stealing postflop difficult)? Too early to be getting out-of-line and splashing around, but big stacks, so whatever I guess.

Flop call is also pretty meh. We still have the guy behind us to react (position position position, imo). Our IO suck on a 4-to-a-straight. I guess we're just hoping it ends up HU so we can steal on some cards?

We're getting pretty close to the odds we need to call the turn. Backdoor flush won't be as obvious although there are some scary flush cards that fill in straights that might not get paid off. Dude definitely looks like he's on an overpair. If we're going to call preflop/flop, we really need to make some plays at the pot for this to be profitable, so I would lean to making a raise here. Most players don't want to risk playing for huge $900 stacks with just one pair. If I was in this spot, I'd go like $250 which will be extremely threatening with us in position on the river to play for the rest of his stack. We're never getting JJ to fold (at least at this point) but methinks AA-QQ folds quite a lot here (and TT-88 all the time, and of course AK) and we have a backup plan if he doesn't fold (hit / perhaps barrel if whiff).

I'm guessing by the river it might be too late to bluff at it as all the draws busted, so I think I also just fold at this point.

GcluelessNLnoobG

I really don't get why people are ok with flop call

PF also deserves some scrutiny, I like how we're deep but suited aces tend to be overrated

We have 8 straight outs, backdoor nut flush card and a live ace vs QQ/KK. If we are not continuing this flop we should for sure be folding preflop.

I fold pre. I wouldn't raise flop or river but would consider whether to bluffraise turn.

I like a bluff-raise on the turn. I think we probably play sets this way (call flop, raise turn) so we can balance out our bluffs pretty well with credible value.

River is V-dependent. The bet looks weak, but what can you credibly rep with a raise here? Sets are probably raising turn. You could rep KXcc, but then your flop call doesn't make sense. If V is any kind of decent thinking player, just fold river.

Pretty much this although folding/calling pre is really V dependent. We are getting 30-1 implied which is pretty close, but the Q is will THIS V give us his stack with AA/KK if we hit trips/str8? IF he won't then it is probably a fold.

Once we get to the flop though, hand was played fine. Double gutter on flop and then BDFD on turn....both auto calls.

I missed that we have a double gutter; still, calling with another guy still to act behind us isn't a slamdunk (which is why preflop is so meh, imo).

GcluelessNLnoobG

Pre is def questionable, but folding flop is absolutely and ridiculously absurd vs that sizing. Seriously? This flop is the nuts for A4cc and is about as good as it gets other than flopping quads.

Also unless I'm reading HH wrong Hero is IP so we arent xc. Regardless, even if we werent it's still a standard call.

We have A3cc, which is a double gutter and BDFD.

I prefer a flop raise. Our outs are very clean if we knock BU out of the hand and we have great equity vs overpairs. This is one of our better bluffing combos.

Meant A3cc, my bad typo. Yes I saw the double gutter.

Flop raise is fine too IP it seems.

I missed that we had a double gutter, thought we were just drawing to the 4 straight

Ha. I guess those gut shots are pretty deceptive

Okay, agree. Thanks

Yeah we flopped a double gutty+bdfd lol, never folding flop. I really want to open up my game by raising flop or turn in these spots but just don’t seem to be able to pull the trigger because I don’t know how easy/hard it will be to get them to fold their overpairs.

Seems like when I try to bluffraise here, V just won’t ever fold and I’ll get felted if they 3b shove or call it down.

OTOH though, I had a similar spot later where I opened 97s and someone in the smal blind 3b, we went 4 way to the flop, and the BB cold caller led out like $50 into $150 on a 973ss flop after SB checked, I made it $175 and BB tank folded QQ after SB let his hand go too. This was $500 deep.

So who knows.

You don't have to worry about what they do in spot like this when you're ready to crush. The line is ckr flop small, more on most turns, shove every river (except maybe exactly the offsuit K). The guy is bet-flatting flop almost always. Calling turn often. Folding river sometimes. If you're going to open-call an old guy, you are going to have very little playability with the majority of your range on the majority of flops. When he bets 75 on this board (he just can't but he doesn't know that and neither does the majority of your player pool I bet), you gotta just understand what you're supposed to dowith your continuing range and take solace that he's just dead even if you get stationed off and show down A high.

2nd HH, it's quite different facing a raise w QQ on 973s than 754r.

I’m in position on flop. If I raise his $75 bet to $175, pot will be huge OTT so I don’t see how we can do anything except shove turn. There’s no room to bet turn/bet river. He might just think I’m raising flop with 99 and call me down with QQ-AA.

Also, what if he bet/3bets flop? I would feel like I just surrendered all my equity with the double gutty/bdfd by being forced to fold.

We have equity to just GII if he 3-bets us, assuming he never has a set. Also, it’s pretty suicidal to 3-bet is with an overpair after we raise him on this board. He’s handing our value raises money.