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1 / 3 / 6 Interesting Spot 1 / 3 / 6 Interesting Spot
View Poll Results: What are you doing in this hand?
Call
1 100.00%
Fold
0 0%

10-04-2022 , 07:52 PM
Context:
My stack 800ish
Main villain effective stack 475
500 max buy in - straddle permanently on

UTG+1: red 4s

open 15 - too small?

BTN Call, SB Call, BB Call, UTG Call

75 in pot

Q ♣️ K ♦️4 ♣️

Boom. Dream spot. I bet 35.

BTN Call, BB Call

180 in pot

7♦️

Very wet board. I size to 125

BTN Fold. BB call

430 in Pot
A♣️

BB shoves 300

HERO?
Spoiler:


Call 300

Opponent shows A♦️10♦️


ALOT of draws get there on river, so my question becomes. Is this a profitable call in the long run??
He talks alot about the hand after, stating things like "Would you have checked the river?" "At Least I had a chance to get you fold" "I'd rather be in the betting lead"
*Obviously noob logic

Last edited by onlywanteverything; 10-04-2022 at 08:01 PM.
1 / 3 / 6 Interesting Spot Quote
10-04-2022 , 08:52 PM
If you didn't include the spoiler every poster would tell you its a fold. You went 5 way to a flop with JT and a front flush door being obvious draws and the worst card in the deck hits the river.

V with his "noob logic" made an awesome play but should have tried that move on someone whos less of a calling station.
1 / 3 / 6 Interesting Spot Quote
10-04-2022 , 09:36 PM
Tbh, I can't play well against people who play like that. He called with the backdoor diamond draw only to hit top pair on the river giving him some show down value. He doesn't even know whether he's bluffing or value betting. Wtf am I supposed to make of this?

Anyway, if he's shoving all busted diamond draws, it's a call. If he's turning showdown value hands into bluffs, it's probably a fold, because he has much more value.

I would probably bet more on the turn.
1 / 3 / 6 Interesting Spot Quote
10-04-2022 , 09:40 PM
(serious) Fold pre. You can open 44 from the LJ, but this early, they’re a fold.

(serious) All of your bets are WAY too small. When you bet on a KcQc4x board you need to be making a pot-sized bet. This tiny little 40% sizing is just not a thing. This is a dream situation to make a ton of money from Top Pair and draws, and you’re letting them off the hook.

Same on the Turn. Yes it’s good that you sized up but you’re still betting too small. You raised preflop—you’re the only one who can have a set. Act like it—bet huge! At least bet the size of the pot. (I’d overbet the pot here. You’ll never find a better spot.)

As played, on the River, you have to call because it’s against the rules to fold sets in LLSNL.
1 / 3 / 6 Interesting Spot Quote
10-04-2022 , 09:49 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by OvertlySexual
Tbh, I can't play well against people who play like that. He called with the backdoor diamond draw only to hit top pair on the river giving him some show down value. He doesn't even know whether he's bluffing or value betting. Wtf am I supposed to make of this?
This is actually the most maddening part of LLSNL I’ve discovered so far—Villains making bets who have no idea if they’re bluffing or value-betting. (My favorite is when I was tanking—to save face—with As7s on an 86432ss board after Villain open-bet Max on the River. After I folded he triumphantly showed me 87, saying “I KNEW you were on the flush draw!” And I’m like….”So why did you bet?!?”)
1 / 3 / 6 Interesting Spot Quote
10-04-2022 , 11:01 PM
pot flop. pot turn. if you did that you have an instacall on the river.
1 / 3 / 6 Interesting Spot Quote
10-04-2022 , 11:18 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by davomalvolio
(serious) Fold pre. You can open 44 from the LJ, but this early, they’re a fold.
Disagree...probably. *IF* this is a typical 1/3 game, a 3! Is very rare, though it might be atypical bc it has a perma-straddle. I can sit at most 1/2 or 1/3 and go hours where I'm the only one who has reraised pre. And then when someone else 3! They have to have JJ+. Believing I won't be raised, I can open with any pair from any position. In most of the 2/5 games I play in, your advice would be wise.

So assuming the table plays with no re-raises, opening to $18 is about right. I want the pre bet to be near to 1/20th or less of eff stack so I can both GII when I make my set and be overpaid for the risk of not making the set. IIRC, V had 475 eff, so I like Hero's play.
If flop has no 4 but an A or K vs 1 or 2 callers, I'm 100% going to rep the big slick that every low stakes player assumes is the open.
1 / 3 / 6 Interesting Spot Quote
10-05-2022 , 10:45 AM
My standard open in this structure would be $25.

Size up the flop. Flush draws and kings will all continue. $50 to $75. I probably go $50 vs most villains.

I probably size up turn to $150to $165

River. Vs some villains you are always beat. Vs some some a call is good profit over time. Have you ever seen V bluff before?

Also don't include spoilers so soon
1 / 3 / 6 Interesting Spot Quote
10-05-2022 , 06:08 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by larry the legend
My standard open in this structure would be $25.

Size up the flop. Flush draws and kings will all continue. $50 to $75. I probably go $50 vs most villains.

I probably size up turn to $150to $165

River. Vs some villains you are always beat. Vs some some a call is good profit over time. Have you ever seen V bluff before?

Also don't include spoilers so soon
This my first post, didn't know not to include spoilers.. will next time.

I agree with sizing... unblock all top pairs, two pairs, draws. LOTS of value.
Never seen a bluff but earlier in session against same villian
Flopped flush in BB
Check call
Check Check
Overbet river... he tanks forever and calls.
Took around $800 from specific villain, was defineally out to get me.
1 / 3 / 6 Interesting Spot Quote
10-05-2022 , 06:12 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by davomalvolio
(serious) Fold pre. You can open 44 from the LJ, but this early, they’re a fold.

(serious) All of your bets are WAY too small. When you bet on a KcQc4x board you need to be making a pot-sized bet. This tiny little 40% sizing is just not a thing. This is a dream situation to make a ton of money from Top Pair and draws, and you’re letting them off the hook.

Same on the Turn. Yes it’s good that you sized up but you’re still betting too small. You raised preflop—you’re the only one who can have a set. Act like it—bet huge! At least bet the size of the pot. (I’d overbet the pot here. You’ll never find a better spot.)

As played, on the River, you have to call because it’s against the rules to fold sets in LLSNL.
Do you play a lot of live low stakes no limit? Getting 2-4 callers opening from any position is normal w/ good image. Giving me the 15x profit needed to open with 44. What do you think?

I agree with your analysis on my bet sizing.
1 / 3 / 6 Interesting Spot Quote
10-05-2022 , 06:20 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by DEKE01
Disagree...probably. *IF* this is a typical 1/3 game, a 3! Is very rare, though it might be atypical bc it has a perma-straddle. I can sit at most 1/2 or 1/3 and go hours where I'm the only one who has reraised pre. And then when someone else 3! They have to have JJ+. Believing I won't be raised, I can open with any pair from any position. In most of the 2/5 games I play in, your advice would be wise.

So assuming the table plays with no re-raises, opening to $18 is about right. I want the pre bet to be near to 1/20th or less of eff stack so I can both GII when I make my set and be overpaid for the risk of not making the set. IIRC, V had 475 eff, so I like Hero's play.
If flop has no 4 but an A or K vs 1 or 2 callers, I'm 100% going to rep the big slick that every low stakes player assumes is the open.
So funny you notice it to "A or K vs 1 or 2 callers'. Every noob at 1/2 1/3 believes your opening range can only contain A10+ K10+. Very profitable to C-bet thee flops.
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