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1/2NL, line check...standard river fold? 1/2NL, line check...standard river fold?

11-30-2011 , 11:30 PM
This is vs complete unknowns, so just wanted to check if this is standard or I should play it a bit differently?

Just moved to table with 320 behind. Effective stack 170. Villain in CO looks like young internet kid, 20s, white, sunglasses and earbuds.

I post BB and look down at A 9. Two limpers in CO and button, SB completes, and I check my option. I feel like A9o is too weak to raise to pick up dead money vs unknowns. Before reads I'll assume villains will limp call and be loose-passive on most flops, so I'll have a tough time OOP. Nitty?

Pot is 8 on flop of 9 3 4.

SB checks, I bet 10 for value, CO calls, button and SB fold.

I put villain on any pair or a straight or flush draw.

Pot is 28 on turn 8. I bet 20 again for value. Villain calls with 138 behind. At this point, I think villain probably has a 9, 8, or perhaps a pair+FD, pair+SD hand. Could villain have a naked draw here too? Is my range too narrow?

Pot is 68 on river of 8. I bet 25, planning to fold to a raise. I thought this was a good blocking size. Villain makes it 85. I tank for about 15 seconds, then fold.

Thoughts on river sizing and line against unknowns? Standard? Is river a bet/call?
1/2NL, line check...standard river fold? Quote
11-30-2011 , 11:59 PM
Preflop: If I am on my A game and have reads on most/all of the limpers, I will raise this out of the BB, but this is a rare occurance. (Raising this 10-15% of the time oop) With no reads and just sitting down I am happily checking.

Flop good, turn good. River good, I would bet $30; villain has a flush. River would be a bad bet/call
1/2NL, line check...standard river fold? Quote
12-01-2011 , 12:13 AM
maybe even an 8, either way he's not raising you on the river without having you beat..good bet/fold
1/2NL, line check...standard river fold? Quote
12-01-2011 , 06:59 AM
I like your line, though like pay4myschool said, $30 looks a little better OTR. I'd actually probably go $35/fold, but only because I hate levelling myself based on my sizing looking weak. Looks wp though.
1/2NL, line check...standard river fold? Quote
12-01-2011 , 09:36 AM
I like pre and flop. OTT I'd bet pot again because I think he is still calling all 9s and all draws. The guy open limped in the CO and is wearing shades. We very much do have reads. He is a donk who has watched poker on TV and is almost certainly (<5%?) a winning internet player. It is massive to distinguish "internet players" from "winning internet players.

River is pretty gross. I don't hate c/f TBH because as unknowns I'd say guys who open limp the C/O will be afraid of the flush and fold a decent amount of 9x and will rarely bluff.

Who wants to take a very random stab at counting combos that call/raise river bets. Instinct says it is going to be very close as a value bet, probably slightly bad.

I know "thin value" is the new sexy phrase but it doesn't mean betting every time we might get called by worse.
1/2NL, line check...standard river fold? Quote
12-01-2011 , 06:28 PM
As played IMO, if we bet 10 OOP and get called in this situation we can almost guarantee someone limped with a big hand like JJ, QQ, KK, or, AA, or has a flush draw. Perhaps they hit a piece with a flush draw as well though like you said.

On the turn as a blank, the fact they didn't re-raise you for the right price tells me they are drawing. At this point i'm saying they have flushdraw and possibly a pair as well. Your bet size on the run was good.

Based on his raise, I'd have to say he made a bad call on the turn and got lucky on the river.

His line is limp, call, call, jam..his range is any 9 and draw as said...FOLD
1/2NL, line check...standard river fold? Quote
12-02-2011 , 04:13 AM
WP. This would be an insane river call because the flush got there, so there's really no busted draws except for 56.

The naked draws got there, so you basically beat someone turning a weak nine into a bluff (which I feel is unlikely at this limit) or a guy basically turning like 56 into a bluff when the flush hits, which I think is also unlikely
1/2NL, line check...standard river fold? Quote
12-02-2011 , 10:38 AM
Hand is played well/standard, but your riverbet looks kinda weak & inducing.
A good villain could turn his hand into a bluff here, since it is pretty clear you don't have a flush with this line.
However, readless, river fold is fine.
1/2NL, line check...standard river fold? Quote
12-02-2011 , 02:10 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by @rctic monkey
Hand is played well/standard, but your riverbet looks kinda weak & inducing.
A good villain could turn his hand into a bluff here, since it is pretty clear you don't have a flush with this line.
However, readless, river fold is fine.
I think a b/c line on the river is bad regardless of villain's tendencies. If you think villain is going to spazz bluff this river with total air, I'd rather c/c because B/f just causes you to lose more money when he raises.

The problem with trying to induce here is
1) it's a limped pot
2) if he was drawing, he just got there
3) there are very few draws that bricked out

So basically again you beat absolute air that floated you twice, 56 who is bluffing WHEN THE OBVIOUS DRAW HITS, and a weaker nine that's turning their weak made hand into a bluff.

How often do we expect any of these things to happen in a 1/2 game.
1/2NL, line check...standard river fold? Quote
12-02-2011 , 02:37 PM
I really like the bet/fold on the river. I agree it should be slightly bigger, though.

I think it's worth mentioning too, that against older, more straightforward opponents (who will be folding to a bet with a 9, and will often check behind with an 8) I think check/fold is a better line.
1/2NL, line check...standard river fold? Quote

      
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