1/2 at Mohegan Sun outside of Scranton. Table is pretty fishy and tight, 1 seemingly good player and pretty much everyone else is calling off bets with TPWK or 2nd pair. I've only played a few orbits and won a couple small pots without showing and then called a short stack's all in with AK and lost. I'm around $130 now.

All of a sudden a 30ish guy sits down and pulls out about $1k in $25 chips and asks what's the max he can buy in for. He buys in for $300 and promptly goes $45 from UTG in the dark before the cards are dealt, I'm in MP with AQos and call the $45. Good player a few behind me shoves for $400, crazy guy calls...still hasn't looked at his cards and I fold. Good player has AA and crazy dude shows like J4os or some ****.

He's just completely throwing money around, $30 UTG bets blind, calling re-raises and showing down like T6, Q2, T7 and manages to win a few pots off some guys by hitting. I'm folding the junk I'm getting and didn't chip up b/c I felt I could get my stack in pretty easily if the crazy guy generated action and prob get some dead $ in from other players and now to this hand..

Hand:
Pre
UTG calls $2
Hero UTG+1 calls $2 with 88
3 calls, Villain in CO makes it $17
Folds to hero, I call $17, heads up to flop

Flop -- Pot ~$42
9 9 3
Hero checks
Villain bets $15
Hero???


I have about $110 left with about $55 in pot. Is this a shove all day long against his range? Or is there another way you would have played this?


For the record I always carry 100bb's but for some reason in this situation I thought it may be good to be short. Any general strat talk for dealing with wild players is welcomed!

Also I normally never open limp like this but the situation is obviously not a normal game

Gahhh! Re-raise pre!

You don't adjust to maniacs by calling more and then folding when overs hit. You adjust by shoveling as much money into the pot pre as possible and then hoping you hold. Ride the variance train to value town!

You also get a seat change button immediately and try to get ot his direct right. Then you can limp in, let him raise, see what everyone else does, and either fold or shovel it in as appropriate.

AP: raise to about $35, leaving an easy lead for the rest on any turn.

yeah wtf with calling all over the place. If he's calling with anything shove your good stuff. Even the AQo hand should have been a raise.

And why in God's name would you not chip up? That's ludicrous.

Ya top up and wait for premiums. There is nothing more tilting than getting deal AA only to win a small pot because you did not reload. If your bank roll can't handle this then you shouldn't be playing live. In all seriousness tho this is a dream situation in a live game and even if I don't have much money I am willing to gamble here.

Should have shoved with AQ. Should have 3b with 88 given stack size. Play more aggressively.

Did I not type that right in the AQ hand....the only good player at the table shipped for $400 and had me covered, and we didn't know exactly how crazy the guy was yet. Just went $45 in the dark first hand so we were getting an idea. BTW good player had KK so I folded correctly in that one I think, his range was high pp's and AK. I just don't see that as a profitable call

nope. Raise $50 and shove every flop. If someone else comes along then change the plan, but who's going to call your 3 bet? They gotta be strong to do that. Iso the maniac and profit. If he outflops you so be it.

And this is $45 open raise in a 1/2 game...you're telling me you would just shove over that with 6 guys left to act with AQos?

Absolutely.

Perhaps you should find a limit game. Your current timidity is not indicative of winning play in a big bet game.

I hate guys like this. Wish they'd just go play 2/5. Playing against them drives variance through the roof. Very tough to outplay someone like this when your not hella deep.

I almost certainly would've 3bet pre here hoping to just get it in (then watched helplessly as his lone over or some crazy straight hit). As you say, you're so far ahead of his range...

I get you, but we did end up iso with maniac without raising $50...and with 88 and shortish stack I was wanting more people in the hand willing to stack off with TP. What range of hands would you be 3'betting with against this guy from OOP and other players to act?

I don't feel this is as black and white as you guys are making it. Just getting wild with him is pretty high variance seeming, especially since then I also get no credit with my hands b/c everyone else knows my range is really wide when I try to get iso with the crazy guy.

Wait for premium, wait for him to raise, shove and win

I'm going to go ahead and post results cause obviously they influenced the post...

I shoved and he calls with A9 for trips and I'm a 90/10 dog and lose. Was bummed that he had the damn 9 and started questioning the whole scenario. I have enough $ to play live and I'm a small winning player but I don't exactly like flipping coins for $200...just never really have a plan for dealing with these type of players that I feel very confident about

FYP.

We didn't iso, he did. His giant raise sizing makes set-mining impossible. You have to iso with PPs and hope they hold.

I would hate the part about not knowing what other players are going to do. That's why we want to move to his right. Until then, I would three bet all PPs above 5s ATs+, and AJo+. Once we have "position," I would limp anything playable and if no one called his raise, I would three bet all PPs, andA2s+, and TJo+. If someone calls, I would only three-bet the first range. and often dump the bottom part entirely, not even overcall closing the action.

Then plan is, flip weighted coins for $200. If you can't take that variance, table change.

lol, thanks for your responses Garick, for real. I mean I'd play heads up with this guy all day long, but the other players are what throws the situation off

I would only move to his right if I remained shallow and could get it all in on the flop. Otherwise, I'll iso from his left all night long and let the table adjust to me.

We both agree though, that just calling his raises and folding when you miss is the worst option. If that's the plan, then it's best not to top off because you're just going to lose it anyway.

+1,000,000

Get as much money as possible on the table. If that's only $200, fine, but you want to get value against this fish.

Agreed. I'd probably 3-bet a wider range - almost any A; KQ; KJ; any pair.

I love guys like this. Seriously. They're great for the game. I love it when the $2/$5 game breaks and they sit down at my table and act like the money means nothing. They aren't better players. They just have more money. And more gamble. And think we're scared money and can't play with them.

We had a guy at my home casino who played like the guy described above.

Unfortunately, he hasn't been around lately.

Moving to his right is impossible, okay, so forget that option.

But here you go Spike, you're obviously an expert, so I'd love to hear your strategy...you move to his left, you have 100bb's and tell me what your strategy is for this game with these hands...

1.) Villain raises $25 UTG and you are UTG+1 with 77?

2.) Someone in MP raised to $15, Villain calls on button, and you are sb with KQ?

3.) 3 limpers, Villain makes it $20 in MP, and you look down at A9s?

4.) 3 limpers, Villain makes it $12, you are in HJ with 66?

None of those examples is maniac style. Sounds like standard raises.

You fold or raise in all those situations. In the AQ hand was his bet in the dark? So obv shoving is good vs. random hand. And if he is making super large pre flop raises you should only be playing the top of your range AQ-AK 88+.

Maybe the trick would be to buy in short so you can just shove over his opening raise. So say buy in for 40 bb he raises 10 bb and you look at AJs or any have he hands you mentioned above. Then you are only risking a fraction of a buy in and you are a slight favorite. Once you get deeper then you just tighten up your range. It really isn't impossible to beat this guy you may just be card dead. In a similar situation I waited 3 hrs for AA against a loose gambler and I doubled up after 3 betting and leading flop. It really isn't rocket science you just need to be patient and not play speculative hands.

He wasn't a complete tard...he also folded several hands and checked down others. This is a real example buddy, sorry if it doesn't fit in your simplistic bubble


edit: and really??? lol, 12.5bb UTG raises are standard in your game from a guy with ATC? WTF happened to this website in the last few years?

But he clearly shows the capability to shove 250bbs over your standard 3bet with ATC


And MOST IMPORTANTLY--- there are other players to act!!

How do you know he has ATC when he 12x it UTG? Maybe he picked up a big hand and is playing off his image. If he really has ATC then seat change if you don't like playing marginally strong hands on his direct left. This isn't rocket science.