I'm just doing a quick preflop check-up here to make sure this is an install-call since I'm getting over 2:1 and, even though it would suck to be up against dominating hands like AK/AQ, against most pocket pairs I'm just on the bad side of a coin flip. Standard, right?

Preflop (10 players): Hero is Button with K Q
UTG straddles to $5, MP calls $5, Hero raises to $20, shortstacked SB goes all-in for $66, everyone folds to Hero who needs $44 to call (with ~$96 already in pot)

Nothing to see here, /thread?

GmakingsureIhavethebasicsdownG

I don't have pokerstove handy but I imagine this is pretty close depending on what range you give villian. I probably call but I'm not fist pumping over it.

What's the table dynamic?

If you know he's capable of crazy moves then call. I'd prob fold here but depends what I think of the player.

In the first place I'd probably call in position rather than raising as people can put you on a move (with straddle) and shove then you probably need to fold your marginal hand.

At best you're a small dog, maybe worse, I would fold.

If SB is pear/AK then I'm sitting at 39% equity; down to 37% if he's doing this with AQ. Course I don't have poker stove at the table, but I'm kinda assuming that whenever we are getting over 2:1 that we have to be calling in these situations?

IT DEPENDS.
Just last night I folded KQ on the button.
1-2NL MP player raises to $6, 1 caller, I am on the button with KQo, I FOLD.

MP player who raised, had earlier limped in with AQ (flopped TPTK and nut flush draw - checked called to the river) Then had limped in with AK (and complained that AK never wins when he got beat).

Now a player that has done nothing but limp, limp, limp (and shown AQ and AK as some of those limps) NOW THIS GUY OPEN RAISES to $6 ?

What does KQo have beat that this guy is raising on? EASY FOLD.

Of course I'm going to be at least a small dog, but I'm a small dog getting over 2:1... am I missing something?

Unless the SB is tighter than a virgin.......our chips are in the pot before we can say:

~~gobbledygeek~~

This is a totally different situation.

In your situation, your being asked to call a tighty raise with an easily dominated hand with no money invested in a pot with no dead money in it.

In my situation there is a shortstacked player who has picked his spot to go all in (and he's probably on a range of any pair + AK, heck, maybe even AQ and suited connectors here, although I realize I didn't give a range in my OP) and we're getting over 2:1 here to make a call.

I thought this was actually a pretty standard check-up, /thread after a confirmation or two. Am I out to lunch here?

GcluelessnoobG

Plus what's your stack and the other 2 stacks?

I'm more concerned with making sure the call of the all-in is correct, and at this point the other stacks have folded and are thus irrelevant.

I realized my first raise on the button is debatable and stack sizes would be important in that decision, but I left that info out as I'm not interested in that part of things. I insta-called the all-in and just wanted to make sure this was sound play.

Everyone else folded.

Yeah, so it a tighty all-in occurs from a shortstacked player who has picked his spot to go all in we should immediately call with our easily dominated hand because we are getting over 2:1.

Oh wait --- and he's probably on a range of any pair + AK, heck, maybe even AQ and suited connectors here, although I realize I didn't give a range in my OP) and we're getting over 2:1 here to make a call.

You might have realized you didn't give a range in your OP, so I gave and example of folding KQ from the button and explained that the villian had a raising range of AA, KK, and maybe QQ.

Now all of a sudden this unknown SB in your OP will push short stacked with any pair AK, AQ and 'heck' maybe even suited connectors?

Really, why? You might check some posts here about bad live players and raising ranges short stacked.

Some players might even tighten up their raising range when SS.

But I am a noob -- of course the SB in your example plays perfect 2+2 Strat, so it is an insta-call -- yes, you are correct.

Of course, duh!
My bad. Ignored everyone folded part for some reason

Text results appended to pokerstove.txt

2,116,407,744 games 4.555 secs 464,633,972 games/sec

Board:
Dead:

equity win tie pots won pots tied
Hand 0: 63.229% 58.75% 04.48% 1243405428 94779492.00 { 55+, AJs+, KQs, AJo+, KQo }
Hand 1: 36.771% 32.29% 04.48% 683443332 94779492.00 { KQo }


---

If the players loose enough to be shoving with a range like this..

But on the flip side, there's live players who play ridiculously tight, more like this-

Text results appended to pokerstove.txt

493,143,552 games 1.023 secs 482,056,258 games/sec

Board:
Dead:

equity win tie pots won pots tied
Hand 0: 79.249% 78.76% 00.49% 388386852 2423022.00 { QQ+, AKs, AKo }
Hand 1: 20.751% 20.26% 00.49% 99910656 2423022.00 { KQo }


---

(Possibly an exageration but you get my point)

It's only a super standard snap call against a loose opponent, otherwise think about his range and decide how your holding compares against it, and consider that against the odds being laid.

You only need 31% so if his range his AK/AQ/any pair, then it's a call. Some villians might shove with any pair here but a lot of people won't with smaller pairs. If you take 22-77 out of his range I imagine it's going to be really close and could even be a fold.

In summary, I don't think it's a snap call; you have to evaluate how tight villian is. If he's really tight I think it's a fold, if he's average to loose then it's a call.

As mentioned, you need some reads to estimate a range.

- if villain is >50 years old, is always in the card room, knows everyone by name and is often falling asleep at the table, fold.

- if villain is asian (Lol racist, I'm ethnically Chinese), especially if he's Chinese, call.

- if villain is one of those strange shortstack punters who wander into The Vic (big London Cardroom) at 3am wearing popped collar A&F polo Ts or out on a drinking night with the lads, call.

That kind of thing.

Dear Lord where is the ignore button.

There's a great section in Sklanskys NLH:TaP about calling AIs, I don't recall the exact numbers, but getting over 2:1, I believe this is a call against an opponent who plays more than top 10% of hands.

Ya, I probably shoulda included a read in OP cuz I realize how this certainly can sway the decision. OP was definitely not a tight old nut peddling man, more like a shortstacked typical loose youngish opponent, so I thought all pairs were within his range.

I definitely do not think that this is a snap call. It is close but entirely player dependant.

Then you might add complete air to his range, simply trying to take the pot down and add to his short stack with a dramatic all-in that folds the typical passive player (after a lot of hemming and hawing and finally making the "good" laydown). Snap call.

depending on the image of sb i think this comes down to, but i'd be inclined to call.

Agree with the above stereotypes, and imo shorties very often surprise me with how light they will push in this spot. I'd expect to see AT+ and any pair. You might even see A5s.

calling is definitely not a mistake