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1/2 new Orleans harrahs 1/2 new Orleans harrahs

08-04-2013 , 02:50 AM
Hand 1) Had 300. ak on the cutoff. Raise to 7, get three callers

Flop 36k rainbow

Bb raises to 25 hero raises to 70... button raises all in for 300..

Hand 2) hero has qq raise to 10.. Get two callers. flop 75j rainbow..checks to me i Bet 25, one person calls. Turn j goes check check.. River 2 villain bets 25..

Hand 3) hero dealt kk raised to 12 gets 3 callers. Flop 7 10: Q
Villain bets 30 hero raises to 90 villain moves all in for 150..

Hero loses 500... How could I have played these hands better

Last edited by dp; 08-04-2013 at 03:03 AM.
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08-04-2013 , 02:58 AM
Cool story bro.
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08-04-2013 , 03:14 AM
Hand 1: raise more preflop, fold to flop shove

Hand 2: raise more preflop, call river, fine, you lost minimum.

Hand 3, raise more preflop, Have a plan, if you raise to induce, great, if not, don't raise.

EZ game!
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08-04-2013 , 09:47 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Buster65
Hand 1: raise more preflop, fold to flop shove

Hand 2: raise more preflop, call river, fine, you lost minimum.

Hand 3, raise more preflop, Have a plan, if you raise to induce, great, if not, don't raise.

EZ game!

Thanks! 1and2 makes sense. The third I was a bit confused plus I was tilting a bit, i put him on a draw or maybe aq, ... I guess I could have called his flop bet 30 and reevaluated on the turn when a heart came..

I used to think the correct play was to raise someone on a draw ..but now im thinking if they are the one betting into you calling is the best option..and reevaluating on the next streetWhat do u think

Last edited by dp; 08-04-2013 at 09:57 AM.
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08-04-2013 , 12:22 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by dp
I used to think the correct play was to raise someone on a draw ..but now im thinking if they are the one betting into you calling is the best option..and reevaluating on the next street. What do u think
It is the correct play, but you need to make sure that you are actually charging them the right amount. The pot is approx 48 OTF, he bets 30, making it 78, you raise to 90, making it 60 more to him into a pot of 168. Most people will take those odds to draw at least once, it being somewhere between the 2-1 you need to see both cards and the 4-1 you need to see just one. Of course, with the pot that big, when he shoves he knows if you call, he has the 2-1 necessary to see 2 cards. You will still win the pot 2 out of 3 times, so it's not a bad deal for you, but remember, you want your opponent to make a mistake.

If after he bets 30 OTF he only has 150 behind, your best play is to shove yourself. He will still call, but now he does not have the correct odds to do so. If, however, you know this particular opponent will continue to barrel with missed flush draws, you might just flat, and let him keep firing. As with anything in poker, the correct play is very V dependent, the standard play of shoving the flop as above may miss value vs certain Vs.
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08-04-2013 , 12:46 PM
Buy in for less...you don't understand deeper stack play yet...so why do you want all those chips in front of you....try 150 to 200 to start with till you get more confortable...

That said...hand 1 $7 raise preflop first in co is fine...I usually make it 8 to 10...and if big stacks generally more towards the bigger end if players are fishy...but $7 fine.

flop...a guy over bets the flop donk into you...unless this is normal he is trying to get stacks in...or some players seeing where at....I don't raise, unless he is a drooler....have you seen him put tons of moneyin with tp ok kicker...if not just call and revaluate turn...

As played...come on guy over bets pot, you say I don't care and raise big...and another guy shoves...how can you possably be good against anyone but a complete idiot...

Hand 2...
Bet fold the turn...and probably small bet fold on the river...against most 1-2 players...read might change....

But you have to bet fold the turn...they will call you with much worse then a J...river harder but a small blocking bet might work....let them convince themselves the the AT still good against your missed flush or AK....

As played probably holding my nose and calling getting great odds....hard to see what he bets now for value....or a bluff....but 1-2 players often can make odd value bets and odd flop calls they now bluff with enough to call this small a bet...



Hand 3...
This hand depends on reads but with vilain having 150...and a wet board he might want to get all in with AQ or some combo draws...I probably play it the way you did....
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08-04-2013 , 12:58 PM
Hand 1 is fine if you folded*

Hand 2 is standard*

Hand 3 is villain dependent*

*You def need to be opening larger dude.

My absolute minimum for 1/2 is $12, but my standard raise is $15-$17.

Experiment with it and you'll be surprised. And keep opening bigger. Like last night I was opening to $17 and it was going 3-4 ways. So I began opening $20-25. Like basically with my premiums I am going as big as the table will allow, and at lol 1/2 sometimes that is pretty big.

You are also making your premiums very easy to play, bc 1/2 villains calling $15-$17 with suited connectors or pps or w/e trash they call with are making HUGE errors in regards to their stack size.

Final benefit is table will think you are insane. The first few times it may fold around, but after that they will start playing back.
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08-04-2013 , 11:28 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by dp
Hand 1) Had 300. ak on the cutoff. Raise to 7, get three callers

Flop 36k rainbow

Bb raises to 25 hero raises to 70... button raises all in for 300..

Hand 2) hero has qq raise to 10.. Get two callers. flop 75j rainbow..checks to me i Bet 25, one person calls. Turn j goes check check.. River 2 villain bets 25..

Hand 3) hero dealt kk raised to 12 gets 3 callers. Flop 7 10: Q
Villain bets 30 hero raises to 90 villain moves all in for 150..

Hero loses 500... How could I have played these hands better
Ignoring how you could've played these hands better from a fundamental standpoint (and you definitely could've), if you lost $500 in these three hands then you really REALLY did something wrong here.

Hand 1) Not a big fan of your flop raise, but forget that for now. Once BTN ships you should fold. So that's $77 lost.

Hand 2) Loss of $60. Hand played fine, although I generally raise more preflop ($12-$15) and expect to get same action, but that's table dependent obv.

Hand 3) Not a fan of the flop raise (generally speaking), but assuming you call villain's all in shove, that's a $162 loss. Whether you should call the flop raise is as one poster correctly put it, villain dependent. Your SPR vs him is favorable, but he may never take this aggressive line without 2pair+

Total loss from 3 hands: -$299

So how did you lose $500? You called the BTN ship in hand 1?
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08-05-2013 , 08:42 PM
Yep called the all in from hand 1...
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08-05-2013 , 08:43 PM
gotta lose that $$$
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08-05-2013 , 09:03 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by dp
Yep called the all in from hand 1...
Ok well, that's kinda good news. Here's a spot we you can improve right away. First, let's go with a general claim: Stacking off with top pair top kicker at an spr of 10.7 is gonna cost you money (buy this book immediately and read it at least 3 times to get a better understanding of SPRs).

There are of course exceptions to that claim (there are exceptions to any general claim obv), but that's an excellent rule of thumb to remember. Against certain aggressive mouth breathers, or super loose passive stack off with top pair no kicker players, go ahead and get the money in if the former raises or the latter keeps calling, but against typical risk averse opponents, this will be a losing proposition for you, ESPECIALLY WHEN THAT RISK AVERSE OPPONENT IS SHOWING STRONG AGGRESSION. When an opponent 3bets shoves all in for that much, after you raised the flop on a pretty much drawless board, your TPTK is gonna be cooked like 95% of the time.

Another way to look at it. First guy bets a healthy amount on the flop (he probably has Kx+), you raise that flop with AK, then a 3rd guy overbet ships all in, (he probably has Kx+). There's only 4 Kings in the deck. What are the odds that all the kings are out and you're still the boss after that action? The answer: extremely low. Someone has a set or a cheesy 2pair. It's over.
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08-06-2013 , 01:38 PM
You have some really good info.. Do you coach? Is that your book?
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08-06-2013 , 07:48 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by dp
You have some really good info.. Do you coach? Is that your book?
Too lazy to coach, and I don't really feel qualified to coach either. I haven't even played 500 hours of no limit lifetime yet. My specialty was limit holdem. I converted to NL just this year. That's not my book (too lazy to write a book too!), but that's one of the best books out there for players trying to learn this complex game. It's a must buy. That book will make/save you tons of money over the long haul.

Also, if I were you I would read every single good nl book you can get your hands on. Here's an excellent thread to figure out which books to purchase:

http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/17...g-list-778915/

Constantly read those good books, and constantly read these forums and your game will improve dramatically in less than a year.
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08-06-2013 , 08:33 PM
just wanted to say thanks to ILP for the advice about PNL. ive had that book for a year on my kindle, havent read it and totally forgot about it,lol.
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08-09-2013 , 01:20 AM
Hand 1,2,3. Need more info. Why are you check raising/raising. Because you have premium hands???? Wrong answer. Meditate on that for 10 minutes. Say 5 hail marys and reply.
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08-09-2013 , 11:22 AM
Not much more to add, most guys hit the nail on the head with your PF raises needing to be bigger. I would suggest 5X plus an extra $2 for every limper.

Also it appears your raises are hand dependent. $7 for AK, $10 for QQ and $12 for KK. If there is something else causing these adjustments then ok, but if these numbers are based on hand strength, QUIT! Smart opponents will quickly figure that out and punish you for it. Keep the same formula for your entire PF raising range.
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