Agreed with this.

Some games can be lose, where no one 3 bets. Other games, people are 3 betting a lot. I wouldn't just blanketly say no one 3 bets light at 1-2.

Idk...I’ve played in sooooo few games below 5/T where people routinely 3 bet light. I played in a 2/5 game the other day where I was opening like 40% of hands because of how soft it was, the only other pro there didn’t 3 bet me once, and the only time I got 3 bet, people showed down JJ/KK/AA. That’s somewhat representative of LLSNL in my experience.

I suppose it’s possible your game conditions are different, but maybe try actually keeping track everytime a 3 bettor shows down their hand, or just track how many 3 bets there are each orbit. I think you might be surprised.

I’ve played a decent amount of poker across a number of rooms. The only place I’ve seen a lot of aggression at the lower stakes was LA.

I would prop bet that JJ and AK get played as a flat at 1/2 at a higher frequency than AJs gets 3 bet. My only disclaimer is that short stackers admittedly like to just pile it pre, I’m talking about people playing 100bb+ deep.

Never in a million years (rhetoric, I know). I can remember maybe 1 time JJ was played as a flat in 1-2, and the whole table was like "wtf are you doing" (was UTG or EP, I don't 100% remember).

I know a couple of years ago, people were trying to get tricky with AK, high pocket pairs by just limping, but it's almost the opposite in my experience.

you are changing your argument now. yesterday you said...

I agree there are fewer light 3Bs in 1/2. I'm only arguing that you can't discount it as "no one".

There are a wide range of skills and temperament in 1/2. I'm in the same state as you. In north and central Florida, there are no or rarely 5/10 games in the card rooms. In some rooms, Oxford, there are only occasional 2/5 games. In JAX, Daytona, Orange, and Oxford, it is very common to have the best 2/5 players sitting in 1/2 games while they wait for a seat. Big O players also occasionally sit 1/2 while waiting. Sometimes those players are so bored they play every hand, some of them think they can bluff anyone off of everything.

I saw one Big O player go through 7 buy ins on a 1/2 table in the course of an hour because the money just did not matter. He wasn't getting cold decked, he was just playing super loose and wild. I also saw that same guy rebuy 7 times in a PLO8 tournament. Even if he had taken 2nd place, he still would have lost money. Idiots abound.

It's interesting. The "good" players I play with (many of them play poker for a living) 3bet light often. The casual players almost never do and are more likely to limp with QQ/KK/AK. The only hand they raise is AA and it is absolutely the only hand they 3bet with.

I'll 3bet light, but I know I don't do it often enough.

(FWIW, I'm a PLO player above Hold 'Em and I'm a big O player when there is a game, but I don't play NLHE the way I play PLO / Big O. Playing Big O right now!)

OP is deep, but not the raiser. If you take His Holiness Bart Hanson’s 15/25/35 rule, you need to be able to win $465 to make the call. The most likely opponent is the broad her raised. She only has $300. I would’ve just opened myself. As played, possibly fold to her large raise pre. As played here, though, you gotta put the money in the middle here.
Raise pre. Winners don’t limp.

I had to goggle it. I learn something every time I come here. That is new info to me. Thanks.

Somewhere in the abyss, a certain poster in here is triggered


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Real talk but my online stats are something like 20/17 for 6m (prob a bit too tight but whatever). But my three bet was like 10%. Online people can clearly see what’s going on, but live, three bets draw attention due to their relative rarity. Like someone opens 50% of hands and it never even crosses their mind to 3 bet tens.

And people will play very bad against your 3 bet because of the relative rarity.

Generally if someone is opening too wide, you should just 3 bet the hell out of them, because they’ll either sacrifice the pot to you too much, or call you with way too weak of a hand range.


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That’s not how English works lol. When I say “no one at 1/2 3 bets light”, I’m not alleging that there hasn’t been a single person in the history of planet earth who has 3 bet light at 1/2. “No one” in this context clearly means that it is rare. It means that it’s rare enough that it has no meaningful impact on your winrate or the EV of your decisions.

If I think a hand would be a profitable open in a game with zero percent light 3 bets, I’m also opening that hand at 1/2 with their actual light 3 bet frequency

Bart Hanson is the best authority on LLSNL. I agree with almost everything he says. However, I think 15/25/35 is outdated. I explained why I'm not into this earlier in the thread:

Results? I want to see the straight shown, only for the house to come in.

i also want to know what happened lol

Ping, because I hate it when the host leaves us in suspense.