See so many "do i fold here" posts, Thought I'd post a hand that stuck with me for a while to see if there was a way I could take a better line to extract value.

1/2 NL at the Venetian, so I don't have many reads on the players. I had just moved tables, and only one of them was a guy I had played with before (in the previous day's session), who also turned out to be my opponent in this hand.

There was a lot limping going on, and this hand occurred about 2 orbits into my time at the table.

Hero has ~$375 behind, though I hadn't yet played a hand at the new table. I am female, and though I know my style, i can't really tell you how the other players at the table viewed me. I tend to assume that random guys at a poker table will automatically stereotype me as weak, just due to my gender. This could be wrong, but in my experience, it usually holds.

Villain is a middle-aged middle eastern guy. He seemed like a weak player (calling station type) from what I saw from the previous day's session, and he has about $300 behind.

Preflop:
Hero is in CO and looks down at A3. 4 limpers, so I limp behind, BTN folds, SB completes and BB checks. Pot is $14 ($12 minus rake so far)

First question: should I put in a small raise here pre? Or go with the table flow and limp as I did? A3s would definitely be near the bottom of my raising range, esp. with 4 limpers in front of me. I know i'll get the inevitable "fold pre" posts, but this table, from the couple orbits I had seen, was playing fairly passively, and I felt like I could definitely handle some postflop action.

Flop: 725
SB bets $7, 1 limper calls, Hero raises to $22, folds to SB who calls, MP limper folds. Pot is $53

this is where I think I made a mistake. If I had flatted, the MP villain would still be in the pot, and though I have no real reads on the guy, He might be willing to pay me off if my draw hits. Should I just flat here? Is raising this much spew? I'm always at a loss in this spot with a combo draw/semibluff in LLSNL, especially at a table where I have minimal reads. Thinking back, a minraise in this spot might not be terrible. I can't see myself folding ever, because SB's bet is so small.

As for SB's range, it really could be just about anything in a limped pot, though his small bet on the two-tone flop rules out sets in my mind. So I'm leaning toward A7 or maybe K7/Q7/87/67, possibly a flopped two pair.

Turn: 4
SB checks, I check behind.

Anyone see a way to bet here without scaring him away?

River: 3
SB checks, Hero ??

obv betting here, but question is to sizing. SB makes no indication that he's afraid I have the flush, and actually seemed to perk up a bit on the river. He called my flop raise, so obviously he has some sort of hand, and the 3 completed any straight draw. Faced with the question of "what's the biggest bet he will call"...

the more i read it, the more I HATE my flop raise...

Bet 25ish I guess. Flop raise isfine. Seems like a brag post

the best way to extract value from a hand like this is to find out why SB would call your raise on the flop.

If I was SB, and i hit 2 pair on the flop, i would c/c or c/r to to extract value.
I will check straight draws, with fd on board.
Only reason to throw the 7$ out there is to try and take down this pot with top pair.
If the SB was donk, he may have taken a stab at board and then called your raise hoping to spike an overcard.

Unfortunately i think that as soon as fell, you were only getting value if SB has 2 pairs.

Bet 60% pot on the turn and bet 75% on the river. If he has 2 pair, you will get called on both streets and get paid. If he doesn't, he will fold on turn and your monster stays in its underground cave .

Over-bet the pot. If he has a straight, he's calling. If he has less than a straight, he's rarely calling unless you bet like $10.

You're just being result oriented for raising the flop.

How do you view another female player like yourself? My usual perception of female players is "weak tight," and when weak tight is firing, he/she usually have a very very strong hand.

I would play the same way on the flop, bet on the turn, and hopefully river improves villain's hand. If villain has a set or two pairs, turn might be the only time you'll get him to commit more chips. He might have already given up the pot, especially on the river when he cannot improve his hand.

Preflop is fine given so many limpers. If there had been only one or two limpers, I would raise and try to isolate.

OTF, are you raising for value or as a semi-bluff? Obviously it's not for value because you don't have a made hand, so it's a semi-bluff. I say this because your raise size looks like it's for value (like you want to get called) but when you're semi-bluffing, you're looking for fold equity.

That means your raise size should be bigger. Something like $35 looks good. Otherwise, raising like you did does nothing but bloat the pot and you're going to miss your draw OTT far more often than hit.

Once the heart comes OTT, checking is probably ok. I just don't think you're going to get 3 streets of value, so checking makes it easier to get paid OTR. If I were to bet though, it'd be something like 1/3 pot. Especially if I were female. I'd want to make it look weak and hope to get c/r.

OTF, if he perked up and you think he's calling, just pot it.

You can be raising here for value or semi-bluff? Ok... But we can be raising for a free card on a draw as well. WHere do you rank that?

I say the raise should be to $20 here and if we get 3 bet its smaller and we can still go with our hand and have options other than shoving.

I bet the turn still. We made our hand but what hand raises in position then checks behind? A monster for sure when that card comes. So I bet it as a bluff turn cbet. Now we can set up a shove river bluff as well.

This line doesnt make that much sense to extract value but with the nuts here it makes the most sense to me. If we had a nut hand that didnt include the Ah then a different line might make sense.

I have two lines of babble for you...

1) On the turn: I like betting trying to represent something other than the monster you have. Imagine you made top two pair on the flop. Now the scare card comes on the turn. Make what looks like a scared little 'please go away' bet. Maybe some villains even raise you here to 'see where they are at.' Wouldn't that be nice?

2) Realize that unless this villain is spewy/bluffy you may not win any more $$ unless he has a good hand. So again imagine on the turn that villain has a baby flush or just hit a straight. He could also have two pair or even just top pair. You will make your money from him when there are still cards to come.

The worst case scenario here is you check the turn, then bet 1/2 the pot on the river because you don't want him to go away. He calls with a baby flush. Ouch.

Flop re raise is fine I suppose, though we're getting 4-1 odds to just call, plus we figure we'll get a couple more callers if we call, so we can look at it like 6-1+implied odds(especially if you've now just folded out someone behind you with a weaker flush draw). I usually like to re raise semi bluff with flush draws when I'm not getting the odds to just call it. But re raise is fine too as it takes it down or bloats the pot if you hit. I would bet the turn however. If villain called your 3 bet on the flop, he either has a decent hand or is calling station with top pair. Either way, he probably isn't folding. I would go half pot on the turn and river, maybe a little less so he might think you're weak.

I would usually always limp this hand behind after multiple limpers. Stacking people with 100 BB stack sizes at this level doesn't require a pot sweetener.

I'm cool with the raise on the flop. We have an overpair, nut flush draw and a gutshot, so some huge equity. Plus we probably get to take a free card on the turn if we wish.

The only reason I would ever consider checking the turn back is for BBJ purposes (i.e. I would shoot myself in the head if a bet somehow scared off a potential BBJ hand; do not underestimate the effect of these on our bottom line, and we get in so few spots to actually have a shot at them). Otherwise, lets start building that pot in order to get stacks in. I bet at least half pot and hope to get action.

As played, on the river I might just lol shove. Seriously. A calling station is going to have trouble releasing his hand here and level themselves into calling enough of the time that makes shoving more profitable than getting called on a rinkydink bet, IMO.

BTW: If you thinking shoving the river is joke, consider this. The board has 4 to a straight plus 3 to a flush. Just to throw out some numbers, let's say villain would call a $20 bet 50% of the time. That's a $10 profit. In order to make a shove of $276 just as profitable, villain would only have to call about 4% of the time. Take into account the times he has the straight, or a baby flush, or two pair, or set, well, he's calling more than 4% of the time and we're making a killing.

GcluelessNLnoobG

I think pre-flop is fine, especially in late position, no reason to raise and most the time if you did at 1/2 you aren't thinning the field that much. I could see you betting $16 and everyone calling.

I like the flop raise as a semi-bluff. I actually do not like the turn check. The check makes it look like you have the flush to me. If I were you I would bet. The villian probably doesn't have much to pay you off here, but your best line is to bet here. I bet $35-$40 on turn. And somewhere around $70-$75 on river if it gets there. As it is he probably folds to any bet though, but who knows.

How can villain possibly have a hand that has potential to win the BBJ but would fold to a turn bet?

Well, yeah, it's highly unlikely he lays down a set or 87h here ("I know you have the nut flush"). But is it really worth the risk / life tilt? If we were turning BBJ hands every other session then obviously this slowplay would begin to lose substantial value over the long haul, but it doesn't happen often enough for us not too slowplay here, IMO.

Honestly, you cannot extract much value from your hand on the river unless you're playing against fish. You should have decided if you want to get pot committed way before the river. On the flop and turn most money has got to go in so that the river bet doesn't look like a monster especially with that board. I wouldn't pay you off if I would be in that game. You've got to understand that action that goes like: raise flop, check on the turn and then leading into the pot on the river it signals a big hand and you'll not be getting paid unless some fish gets involved.

Che,