Open Side Menu Go to the Top
Register
1/2 AK deep 1/2 AK deep

11-04-2011 , 07:21 AM
Hero has a LAG image at the table to villain in question, who has sat for about 20 minutes. I've been 3bet by him once whereas I folded, then a few hands later I was raised by him after my cont bet into a 3 way pot of A-10-5 rainbow... I folded.

Villain is mix of white/asian, 25 yr old fwiw, never seen/heard about/played with before. He had bought in for $300 and won a few small-medium pots without showdown. Limped a fair amount, even open limped a couple times from EP so initially I was somewhat skeptical of his caliber of play.

Hero is UTG with little over $400 stack and AK. I raise $15
MP had about $300, calls
BTN calls and has my stack covered

Flop is AJ2

Hero bets $35, both MP and BTN call

Turn is 9

Hero bets $90, MP folds, BTN shoves his $450ish stack across the line pretty quickly.
1/2 AK deep Quote
11-04-2011 , 09:04 AM
I think I am pretty comfortable folding here.
1/2 AK deep Quote
11-04-2011 , 09:16 AM
grunch

This is a pretty trivial fold imo. I get it though...this kid was "owning you" recently and you were sick of it at this point, but thats no reason to stack off here with one pair when its most likely not good and if not drawing dead already then drawing pretty thin.
1/2 AK deep Quote
11-04-2011 , 09:34 AM
In spots like this, I just think of my AK as A3.
Fold.

As Superman says, it's not nice getting owned- but revenge is much better when I actually get revenge... not the fantasy of it when I call all-in before I see his A9o.
1/2 AK deep Quote
11-04-2011 , 09:39 AM
The only hand your beating is T8 which is a turned open-ended straight/flush draw.

Trivial fold IMO.
1/2 AK deep Quote
11-04-2011 , 09:47 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by ThierryHenry
I think I am pretty comfortable folding here.
+1
1/2 AK deep Quote
11-04-2011 , 10:21 AM
Snap fold
1/2 AK deep Quote
11-04-2011 , 12:19 PM
It is hard to get a good read after only 20 minutes of play. His range seems to be two pair or set of 2s IMO. I wouldn't stack off on this board when better spots will come up later in the session if you think villian is trying to outplay you.
1/2 AK deep Quote
11-04-2011 , 12:37 PM
Tough spot. If villain has a monster why not raise the flop here rather than overcall a possible flush draw/combo draw? Though you mention he has seen you fold twice to aggression and he doesn't want to lose you.

If he is doing this with air he is my hero. I have started bluffing more on the turn and river in spots like this...where your holding is obvious so villain must have you beat.

Thing is you still should fold...
1/2 AK deep Quote
11-04-2011 , 12:54 PM
grunch

This is an easy snap fold. the question comes down to this. Do you think villian will do this with AQ or wors. Even if he has a draw i think it is likely he doesnt do this with just a flush draw, but rather a hand like K10hh or Q10hh

Last edited by Wantlivepoker; 11-04-2011 at 12:55 PM. Reason: and of those two hands i think q10hh is more likely
1/2 AK deep Quote
11-04-2011 , 01:50 PM
FWIW if this was a HU turn I would check expecting to induce spew. It allows villain to think he can run you over with his draws/air/weaker aces. But this is a different hand/dynamic

BTW our hand is treading an uncomfortable river spot if called even in one spot, especially if we are unimproved by then. Another thing to consider when playing this hand.
1/2 AK deep Quote
11-04-2011 , 03:51 PM
Result:

Spoiler:
Hero tanks for 2-3 minutes and folds, villain flips over 35
1/2 AK deep Quote
11-04-2011 , 06:16 PM
He's either Ivey in a facemask or an ATM, good fold.
1/2 AK deep Quote
11-04-2011 , 06:42 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by timmay28
Result:

Spoiler:
Hero tanks for 2-3 minutes and folds, villain flips over 35
Let's help OP on how to adjust to this villain. Next time villain raises us in a similar situation, are we going to level ourselves into folding AGAIN because, zomg, villain knows that we think he's a bluffer, therefore he can't be bluffing?

The way I treat these villains is to take tricky lines with them.

On boards that are semi-wet, check back the flop (if a scare card falls, so be it, it won't always happen, and villain won't always have the draw anyway) then bet the turn small to induce a raise, be prepared to just call the raise and let him keep bluffing. After a few showdowns of this, villain will now realize that he can't narrow down your range just based on your flop checks or bets...
1/2 AK deep Quote
11-04-2011 , 07:06 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by timmay28
Result:

Spoiler:
Hero tanks for 2-3 minutes and folds, villain flips over 35
the 4 was coming on the river, good fold
1/2 AK deep Quote
11-07-2011 , 09:38 AM
OP, you lost $50 with AK.
Many players would lose far more- and even in this pot, Villain had outs. I think over 100 similar spots, you're well in the black.

I really do think being able to lay down AK is often a sign of a thinking, balanced player- and those are the players I take care not to screw around with unless I think I have it.

Well played.
1/2 AK deep Quote
11-07-2011 , 10:49 AM
You played the hand well - including the fold.

Adjustments for future hands... 1- raise higher pre flop. you will Isolate him and you need to find out where he folds hands like 35o. His biggest leak is his preflop calling range. Exploit it.

2- open up your range since your range still dominates his range. You will then hit some disquised hands that will be big, then, play big hands as if they were tptk. his strategy is to get you off tptk. Exploit both his percieved narrow range you have and his wide opening range.

3- play tptk like middle pair. Pot control with a check or a probe bet. If it induces bluffs, the bluffs will be smaller and you can call with your underrepped tptk. Be mindful that he can have 2 pair with any flop, so your TPTK hands are worth nothing more than showdown value. It is nice to have under repped hands with showdown value against very aggressive players. Exploit his post flop agression.

4- overbet the turn. punish his drawing hands. He will raise or call alot. If you find him making calls with improper odds, exploit that too. I have found that people aggressive with air are more likely to get attached to drawing hands. His goal is to win every hand and he will make mistakes in order to do that. Exploit, Exploit. Exploit.
1/2 AK deep Quote
11-07-2011 , 11:00 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Poe
OP, you lost $50 with AK.
Many players would lose far more- and even in this pot, Villain had outs. I think over 100 similar spots, you're well in the black.

I really do think being able to lay down AK is often a sign of a thinking, balanced player- and those are the players I take care not to screw around with unless I think I have it.

Well played.
did i miss something?

hero bet 15 btf, 35 on the flop and 90 on the turn. that's 140 out of an effective stack of 400. after the villian's turn raise pot is 330ish and hero has 260 left.

didn't the commitment threshold get passed at some point?

Last edited by 2cute; 11-07-2011 at 11:01 AM. Reason: fix minor math mistake
1/2 AK deep Quote
11-07-2011 , 11:08 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by 2cute
did i miss something?

hero bet 15 btf, 35 on the flop and 90 on the turn. that's 140 out of an effective stack of 400. after the villian's turn raise pot is 330ish and hero has 260 left.

didn't the commitment threshold get passed at some point?
Ummm... no, but I clearly did. This isn't even a comprehension issue- just a plain fail at reading.

So, I still fold, but not happy about having lost three times more than I first thought. I'm not sure you could have done much differently, though.
1/2 AK deep Quote
11-07-2011 , 03:25 PM
nice play buy the kid. gotta love the courage to put it in with 5 high in a deep stacked situation.
1/2 AK deep Quote

      
m