$1/$2 NL live cash game

I'm in the sb with As3s. mid position player raised to $6. Two players behind call along with me and BB (5 way pot)and I have $75 behind. Flop comes 9s8sJh. My plan is to check raise all in since I had some fold equity. I check, BB checks, preflop raiser bets $11, guy behind calls, guy behind him raises to $40. I ended up folding thinking he had made straight and didn't think I was getting right odds.

What should I have done different if anything?
Was I getting the right odds?

He ended up flopping a set of nines.

Buy in for money.

Yes, folding the flop was correct. No you were not getting the right odds.

Fold preflop.

Hi, welcome to the forum.

I strongly suggest that you start off your poker journey by learning about the odds to hit certain hands. It is going to make these decisions much easier at the table. Consider it your first of many homework assignments.

To start off with, let's look at your call pf and why everyone is telling you to fold pre-flop. You are about 20:1 against to hit two pair or better on the flop with A3s. You have $75 to start and the bet is $5. That means at a minimum you need to win $100 to break even. In reality, you'll need to win even more for the times you don't win that much money and when you lose even when you hit two pair or better. That means at least 2 people will need to be in the pot with you when you go all in. That isn't going to happen much. Since you can't get paid off, you want to fold pre-flop.

Moving on to the flop, the pot $27 (rake removed) and you have $69 left. If you shove here with the nut flush draw, you're about 2:1 against hitting it over the next two streets. Pot is about $80 and you're putting in another $69. You need to win $138. Therefore, another $58 must go in the pot. The raiser already has $40 in, so you are only getting an additional $29 from him. Therefore, pre-flop raiser also has to come in and call to make this profitable. If we knew more about him, it might be right to shove. In the majority of cases, the answer is no. He'll realize his over pair isn't likely good.

Good advice above.

I'd just argue a little with Bodybuilder saying to buy in for more money. Yes, he is right, it is a better, more profitable game with deeper stacks. That's only true when you are good though!

While you learn it is fine to buy in short and play very tight. This will limit your wins but, when you aren't great at the game, it will mainly limit your losses. To be honest I still buy in short everytime I sit down and I've been playing for 7 years!

I do it because it prevents me losing a big stack in the first hour at the table when I might not know any of the players. Once I get to know how the game is playing I'll either add more chips or continue short stacked. While short stacked I'm spending 95% of my time watching the others playing pots, trying to read their hands, testing my reads vs any showdowns and getting a feel for any big table dynamics that are going on. 5% of the time I'm playing a strong hand as best I can with a short stack and limited reads.

When I add more chips, potentially up to 200bb in my game, I'm doing it to target particular players I have identified as weak or unbalanced in some way. I have a plan of how I'm going to take them on while defending myself against any tough players. I've always made that plan before I put a big stack on the table.

I prefer to view myself as cautious rather than cowardly but admit there are times I've missed big value when I flop monsters early in a session and felt more of a coward than usual

Thanks for the help guys.

I usually don't play short but this had came at the end of a 6 hour session where I had already ran a full house into quads, top set into a river straight and top two into another river straight so wasn't in the mood to by more chips.

Was the pre- flop call that bad?
The way I look at it is that I assume the bb will call so I was getting 4:1 on my pre flop call and A3 suited is 24% against 4 random hands.
Am I figuring this all wrong or should be looking at it in a different way?

This is wrong for a few reasons.

First, you're not up against 4 random hands. You're up against a pre-flop raiser from MP and 3 callers. So say you're up against a top 20% hand and 3 top 50% hands. That puts you around 20%.

Bigger issue though is that the hand isn't just going to run out from here. There will be additional betting which may mean you don't get to realize your equity (like here). When you flop top pair, you face pretty severe RIO if you're actually going to realize your equity, since with TPNK, if bets go in you're probably beat by a better ace or better.

More generally, I would not make pre-flop decisions based on pot odds and equity to the river unless most of the stack is getting in pre. I would instead think more about implied odds and reverse implied odds.

I do this too but it's a leak. That $75 is going to do you more good if you pick it up and bring it back when you're fresh and in a better state of mind.

In my game a $6 raise is virtually a random hand. Certainly not top 20% and from some players not top 50%.

That's the big issue with the call pre-flop. I like to think about it in terms of visibility. With A3 it's easy to make the best hand but not be able to be certain you have the best hand. As opposed to say 33 where if you flop a set you're extremely likely to be best and if you don't (and money is going in) you're extremely likely to not be best.

Also with A3s if you do flop the best hand it is obvious to opponents what you have (top pair or a flush) so it is hard to get value but easy to inadvertently pay off a better hand. 33 makes a concealed strong hand that is easy to get paid and unlikely to get coolered or drawn out on.

100% emotional statement