1/2

Hero ($355): I've been at this table for probably about an hour. Late 30's wearing sweatshirt and jeans. I definitely consider myself TAG, but my image at table is probably closer to LAG. A few hands prior I raised in EP w/ AQo to 11, 1 caller, Villain 3-bet to 36, I shoved for 143 total, Villain called. I flopped an Ace and it held. Villain didn't show.

Villain ($175): Asian guy probably in his 40's. Definitely LAG. Before my AQ vs him, he raised to 9 out of the BB w/ 87 and flopped a flush, which held.

UTG raises to 5, 2 callers, Villain calls as well, I 3-bet OTB to 29 w/ KJo. UTG folds, other 3 players call.

Flop ($120): T33r

Checks to me, I make a c-bet of 65. First to players fold, V shoves for 79 more.

Do you call w/ two overs to the board here given the pot odds (4:1)???

Unless I read him for weak, no. Your getting odds against TX but not hugely, and if he has something better you are somewhere between in bad shape and drawing nearly dead. You have to put a lot of weak TX and middle pairs in his range before calling is +EV.

If you're 3betting EP raises with KJo, you aren't playing TAG. The reality is the table doesn't believe it either if your 3bets are getting 3 callers. When your credibility is at zero, you don't cbet with air on the flop against 3 players.

As played, yeah, you call. The bigger point is that you made so many mistakes before that finally making a right decision is not a cause of celebration.

I would fold pre-flop in this spot, especially since you have no credibility and your 3b! won't get many folds. You just bloated a pot for yourself and even though you have good position you have a relatively mediocre holding. I also think your c-bet is lighting money on fire too; even on the dry board there are still 3 players left to act and with your image many V's will call down lighter than normal.

This.
In a vacuum your play is fine. And yes, it's close but you call the jam and expect to lose. More importantly I t's very likely you have a FOS image or are at a wild table and shouldn't be 3betting light PF. Be aware of how players think about you and then adjust how you play to exploit that.

Who ever said I was celebrating???

I know I made some mistakes on this hand. Hence the purpose of the post. My primary purpose of this post though was to find out from others, given the way I played the hand to this point, do the pot odds justify me making a call here with two overcards to the board?

Don't cbet, but if you do cbet smaller, the larger size accomplishes nothing.

You have the wrong goal. Your primary purpose should be to avoid putting yourself in this situation in the first place. To paraphrase Limon, getting to the point where you're deciding whether to lube up your bung hole or not shouldn't be your primary goal for the HH. You want to avoid ever having to make this decision again.

That isn't what he is asking though. He understands he made mistakes throughout the hand, he wants to know what the correct play is for his current decision.

And he's gotten a lot of feedback on that decision. But you can't seriously expect this forum to only respond about a single decision in a hand and ignore the rest. At the very least the OP very recently make the aforementioned mistakes and needs the correct thought process reiterated. Posting a hand on here is a package deal, and no one should snub excellent free advice.

OP understands that, but he is asking if he has the odds to call at this point, to which nobody has given an adequate answer.

@OP, at this point you do not have the correct odds to call. His range is made up of over pairs, under pairs (maybe), Tx, and full houses. Against this range we are not getting this right price so this is a fold.

How are you playing this hand pre-flop? I personally think this is a decent spot for squeeze, given the sizing UTG is using. Obviously our image matters, but ide be curious to hear you thoughts on flatting/3betting/folding in this spot.

Thank you Birdman for the feedback I was actually asking for.

I thought it to be a decent spot to squeeze as well. That was my goal. I wasn't happy to get three callers, but when the flop was as dry as it was, I was compelled to make a solid c-bet to rep a strong overpair.

Obviously others disagree.

What do you expect people to tell you?

What OP doesn't understand is that there isn't an adequate answer to his question, because it is largely irrelevant to this scenario.

Blind leading blind.

Have you actually ran the range calculation?

I'm not really seeing any clear mistakes in this hand UNLESS you have been getting a lot of callers when you showed aggression in previous hands. IMO you probably played it fine.

My feel is that the preflop situation is marginal to slightly negative. The small EP raise is often price setting and will have to lay down to a raise. How much you can get the other callers to fold depends on the players and your image. The raise over the small bet and callers looks like a squeeze. With the pot already bloated a bit by the small raise, the 3 bet has to be big, making this more risky but getting you a bit more FE. You do have a plausible hand but not a real value hand.

Once you get 3 callers and totally whiff the flop, you shouldn't c-bet. The pot is bloated, stacks don't look deep and you don't have a lot of equity. This is a good situation to help you tight image by checking and seeing if the next card helps you.

Ran the calculation, turns out to be a lot closer than expected. Range could definitely be wider or tighter, but as we do not have much info on Villain there is a lot of speculation.


Board: Ts 3h 3d
Dead:

equity win tie pots won pots tied
Hand 0: 23.710% 22.79% 00.92% 29020121 1174609.00 { random }
Hand 1: 76.290% 75.37% 00.92% 95983271 1174609.00 { QQ-44, ATs, A3s, KTs, QTs, JTs, T7s+, ATo, KTo, QTo, JTo, T9o }

So yeah I was wrong, this may be very slightly +EV call as you are getting 23.7% when the pot odds are 23.0%, but it is right around break even. Biggest thing is to not put yourself in this situation. The 3bet iso is fine, but definitely not cbetting this flop after you get 3 callers.

Do you see now how OP asked a bad question?

Yes, but every decision in poker can, and should, be analyzed to find the best play. OP just wants to make the best possible decision in the situation he has put himself in, and we shouldn't take that from him.

Well, any time you're getting 4:1 or 20% pot odds, and your opponent is even just somewhat loose, there's really no argument against a fold, especially on the flop.

If OP has to ask the question, there are some giant leaks in his game, and venice was kind enough to point them out to him...

I like the c-bet. Normally I wouldn't do it with 3 opponents, but the board is so dry that it likely didn't hit anyone.

The OP said his image was probably closer to lag. I'm not sure that's a loose enough image to make much of a difference. The AQ hand isn't going to make the OP look like a wild player. However, there is the possibility that the OP is looser than he thinks he is. If he does have a lag image then I can definitely lean more towards checking the flop.

I normally have a very tight image which might explain why I like the c-bet though. I would have folded pf.

It's also so dry that anyone with PP against a LAG probably won't fold.

To answer the question, yes, you have pot odds and should probably call. But looking at this single decision in a vacuum is the wrong way to look at the hand. You can't put 999,999 BB out of a million into a pot on a bluff, and then say you definitely played the hand ok because you were forced to call off the last one. You need to go analyze if the 999,999BB bluff was a good decision.

FWIW, I don't mind lagging it up and squeezing here with 2 blockers, but once 3 people call you it becomes time to put on the brakes. If you contemplate a cbet, you do so knowing that you might be committing yourself to calling a shove from one or more of the 3 opponents, and you decide that's ok before the cbet.

Thank you to all for the feedback. I appreciate everyone's thoughts.

Richard Parker and venice10, while I appreciate your feedback, yours in particular comes across a little condescending. I'm not saying that was your intent, but it comes across as such.