Basically you are saying that no one bets with anything but TP or set.

And no one calls turn bet with anything but hands that beat trips.

^^^^^^look at Vilain description^^^^
He is not aggro Vilain. Him betting flop isn't an aggressive move. He could be leading 2 pair, straight draw, flush draw, any PP, lots 1 pair plus draws. All those hands are standard leads from alot of weekend warriors.

So we call with TP, because we probably have best hand but don't want to stack off.

-Betting flop does not mean he is being aggresive.

-Range I gave has nothing to do with what his raising range on turn is. It was a sarcastic value range.

-Hard to lead flop when we have position.

-Easy call on flop getting 3:1. With what is likely to be best hand. Turn is easy bet after he checks turn.

We are not in tough spot until he raise our turn bet. Which was very unlikely given the board texture.

People bet worse hands than TP. They call worse hands than TP. Draws are paying our turn bet all day long.

This thread has been derailed enough. Your giving away value when we are ahead on turn a majority of the time.

His very passive bet on the flop didn't indicate to me that he wanted to check-call with a hand worse than ours. Interesting analysis you have there.

If you're able to notice his aggression on the flop, then when we bet-fold each player's cards/ranges don't matter. We have way too strong a hand, with room to improve if we're behind, to throwaway by folding.

What is a very passive bet?

RP,

LOL. You're an excellent smart ass.

Legit question and comments...

I am doing my best to follow these logic.

Ya, folding when we are most likely 85-15 dog is pretty easy.

Just as easy as was my value betting turn, when I believe I am 80-20 favorite.

**** happens. We ran into the top of his range.

Rather than starting with the action on the turn, start on the flop and see if people think our hand is strong enough to get three streets of value.

I'm interested if they would be claiming pocket sevens or pocket aces are part of his range as they now seem to believe.

Then go to the turn and found out whether people recommend: checking, bet-folding or bet-calling.

I really don't understand the bet-fold line on the turn because:
1) Our hand isn't in front of Villain's value range, or if it is it's not ahead by much.
2) It looks like the Villain is going for a stack-a-donk play/check raise turn move
3) We have outs to improve if we're behind

Really simply if you had to look at our hand strength on the flop or turn it's not value or bluff, it's SDV. As a default show-down value hands are the worst to bet.

There's over 8000 other posts like this to read about:
Google: site:forumserver.twoplustwo.com "stack a donk"

Whether we're the favorite or not is absolutely irrelevant for two reasons:
1. He's probably not calling with all the absurd hands like pocket sevens you've put in his range
2. And since you advocate a line where we muck our cards.

Rather than thinking in terms of absolute value (TP should only get 2 streets of value), start thinking in terms of how much your opponents will give you.

Is TPMK good for value on the flop? Certainly.

Is it good for value on the turn? Depends on our read and board texture.

We don't know, hence "range."

Could we have better defined range if OP provided better read? Yes.

Could we better define range if this wasn't a limped pot? Yes.

Should we eliminate hands in V's range because it serves some sort of result-oriented purpose? Absolutely not.

I don't really get what you are trying to say here...

Yes, we should always have a plan, but as players develop in their poker skills, they learn to be flexible.

"Ask any racer. Any real racer. It don't matter if you win by an inch or a mile. Winning's winning."

Winning is winning, and with any pot in the money, in most instances, it is +EV to bet.

So stack-a-donk means...

1. Limp pre.
2. Bet flop.
3. Checkraise turn.

If that's the only line you have ever seen given the first 2 actions, I am wondering if you actually played more than few hands of poker.

Isn't that the logic to bet?

Same type of bad logic as someone who limped with AA and missed flopping a set. Yes, AA has showdown value and so does pretty much any pair...

So why do some hands have value and some don't? Because it depends!



So? If he's not calling on turn, he's not calling on river. Why give him a free card? Unless of course you think he's going to turn his hand into a bluff?

This ain't limit, buddy. Mucking is fine.

Well played,turn fold.
His line seems more weighted towards k2,k3 or flopped set.. Especially since he was sb.