I need some help with a hand that happened half a year ago. It was against a dear poker friend, who keeps bringing it up. I'm reconstructing it with the help of two emails I exchanged with my best poker buddy, who was also playing the table but was not involved in the hand.

Single Table Tournament, live low-stakes. Top 3 get a prize, only top prize was worth rooting for in my opinion.

Blinds are 500/1000 (starting blinds were 25/50, now level 7, 15-minute levels).

My stack: 30 BB. I'm in the SB. I was probably perceived as a tight and straightforward player. I played mostly tight but included moves I got away with based on my image.

Opponent's stack: about 20 BB. He's in the BB. I perceived him as pretty loose and somewhat aggressive, certainly capable of making moves.

Table was generally tightish and, strangely, no one had busted yet. I don't really remember other people's stack sizes, except for that of my opponent. I think I was one of the smallest stacks, though.

3 limps before it gets to me. I wake up with KQs and think it's time to try and take it down (more about my thought process later). I raise it to 5000. The big blind calls.

Flop:

Q10x

So I hit top pair, second kicker. I have about 25000, i.e. 25 BB behind.

I bet something like 8000/10000 into the pot of 13500.

My opponent shoved.

What would you do and, much more importantly, why?

I'll wait a day or two till I post what I did, what my thought process was (I remember that clearly) and also what my opponent says about the hand. I've already typed that up, so I don't adapt my original thoughts to what I will have read from you.

Can't wait to get some input. We've been talking about that hand again and again since then and can't seem to agree on it at all!

Call. You have to call 12000 to win a pot of 37000 or so, right? Based on villain description and pot odds I think you have to call here.

I call. I don't play donkaments, but I don't see what he reps.

I'm not that much of an expert - just played about a thousand sit 'n go micros online (profitably), So take this with a grain of salt:

I'm not sure you have the stack sizes right - otherwise I don't get why you're mentioning your stack size on the flop, because unless I misread the OP BB has 10k less than you.

If stack sizes are correct, you just priced yourself in to call the shove. BB has 15k left on the flop, so you're calling 5-7k to win 36500 to 38500. Any way you slice it, you have to call and BB should have known it.

The math doesn't quite add up, either - with three limpers, shouldn't the pot have been 14.5? I don't know that this changes anything.

Playing KQs oop with that many potential players when you still have 30bb left seems marginal to me - the limpers are all getting pretty good direct odds once bb calls your raise. You're lucky to get heads-up.

I'm not sure I like BB's call, either, unless he has a monster. I think I might call with exactly AA in his situation (with the plan to shove any flop) and hope one of the limpers comes along. Even then, I might just take the easy way out and shove pre-flop to win the 8.5 big blinds in the pot.

On the flop, you're in a spot. BB's preflop calling range should be way ahead of you (consisting mostly of overpairs, IMO) your blockers make AA even more likely IMO. Maybe he plays AK this way, but he would have to be pretty blind not to realize he has no fold equity on his shove.

If stack sizes were different, that would change everything ofc.

Looking forward to seeing more answers (including critiques of my answer) and hearing the results.

Still discussing a hand from a 30 bb single table fishament...

facepalm

Nope. 13k even. Blind vs blind for 5k x 2 + 3 x 1k dead limps.

I don't mind that's it's from a long time ago, but it's the wrong forum. I imagine the right one still exists. Somewhere on Earth people are still playing 9man's, right?

The starting stack was obviously not 30 BB, were were in level 7. Also, I'm convinced I played the hand correctly. My friend, however, keeps telling me I didn't. Which is why I said to him I'd post it and ask others.

Yeah. Only there isn't really a correct place for my question. The problem is that this doesn't really regard STT strategy, as you suggest, but it's more important that it was live and low-stakes and that I was not interested in coming in 2nd or 3rd ("only top prize was worth rooting for in my opinion"), which typically makes sense for online S&Gs. So in that sense this STT was much more MTT strategy to me. But it was no MTT and it was live and low-stakes...

You should have just shoved flop with TP in a tourney when BBs stack is just over a PSB. This is pretty straightforward.

i think you should get over this hand lol. As played, I call. You are only 20bb eff and you flopped top pair second kicker. GO WITH IT

you raising to 5x from the sb with kq is hilarious

rest of hand is tremendously standard

Whatever he had he played it worse calling a 5x raise with only 20BB and a couple limpers still behind him. Sucks he got his AA cracked, but if he shoved preflop he wins the pot and you don't bang a K on him.

Also, what the hell were the starting stacks!?

so what happened in this hand?

All right, ginger, so here's what happened and my thought process:

I raise big to get the limpers out of the way and take it down. If the manoever doesn't work and I get re-raised or shoved on, I fold and go from there with still 25 BB left. I also bank on my tight image for this to stand a good chance of working. It had been a while since I'd played the last hand, which was another reason for making this move.

(I raise it to 5000. The big blind calls.)

I see that the BB calls, saying something like, "I'll call that", throwing his chips in. He didn't look strong to me, though, based on physical tells.

(Flop: Q10x. So I hit top pair, second kicker. I have about 25000, i.e. 25 BB behind.)

I'm thinking, great, this should get me the pot now or maybe the BB hit a 10 (if he's got precisely A10: tough luck) or he had a small pocket and will pay me off one more street. JJ, QQ, KK or AA seem unlikely to me because he probably would have re-raised/gone AI with those hands. Same goes for AK or AQ. I'm happy with taking it down now.

(I bet something like 8000/10000 into the pot)

(My opponent shoved.)

I insta-called! I was ready to go with this hand when I bet the flop hard. I didn't raise 3 limpers, getting one caller, hitting top pair second kicker, only to FOLD it to a shove! A shove that looked very much like a move to me. A shove that I might have made as a move myself in his position. Also, I was playing this to win and certainly not to fold on a flop that couldn't have been much better for me! I learnt from my number 1 role model world class tournament player that you can't be afraid to stack off with TP good kicker with 30 BB. This was a prime situation for the concept. Also, the pot was about 36000 (pre 13000, my bet of say 8000 plus his shove of his last 15000) and I would be calling about 7000 more to get the 38000! But even if one doesn't think in odds, what the hell was I going to do with 18 BB left after folding, having let go of a flop I had hit just about as hard as possible in that situation? Wait for Santa Clause to hand me the prize by making me flop a set or trips the next time I get involved in a pot??

Here's what happened after I insta-called his shove:

He shows me Q10. Ooops. I didn't expect that!

Turn: J

River: A

Oooooops. My opponent was not amused.

His take on the hand is this:

1. I played it terribly. I totally over-raised pre and overbet the flop.

2. I should have folded to his shove, putting him on at least AK or AQ.

3. I sucked out on him big time. True, that...

I totally disagree with him on 1 and 2. Plus, I think his preflop call for a fourth of his stack with Q10 was a real mistake. When I told him that, he adamantly said: "But I had POSITION on you!" What good does position do when your hand is generally behind the raiser's range, your stack is covered (but still playable, waiting for a better spot) and you've only got a pot bet left after calling preflop?

So, bottom line: I'm convinced I played the hand well.

After having read your comments:

Some seem to think I still haven't gotten over the hand. LOL to that. As I said, I've always been convinced I played it right. I posted this as a favour to my opponent because he keeps bringing it up, saying I played the hand very badly; essentially he's saying I played it like a fish. While this hurts my pride a little bit, he's been playing poker for years and years whereas I haven't. I like him a lot as a person. I have my poker opinions, based on strategy I've read, seen and experienced, sure, BUT I'm not keen on hybris taking over my poker life. So I thought I'd let other players have their say and then give him the link to this forum and thread. He'll read it if he wants to.

@Todd: LOL! Your read is great Starting stack was 30000, I think. It was set up as a "special STT" (costing 3x the regular buy-in of a STT at this place) and starting with a MTT chip stack.

Hand is bog standard. BB's call pre is bad, but rest of the hand plays itself.

It is not worth half-a-year of argument, not is it worth even one exlamation point, much less seven.

Yeah 100% agree with Garick; his PF call was bad and with that flop and such a small SPR it was going in no matter what. He sucked out on you with that flop then you re-sucked. Not much actual poker in this hand. *shrug*

With a PSB and TPgK you should be shoving. Hand over. Argument over. Not really sure what anyone would suggest as an alternative.