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Top two pair out of the Big Blind, river is scare card Top two pair out of the Big Blind, river is scare card

05-09-2013 , 10:18 PM
I felt this was a standard hand, but have gotten some questioned looks from a few fellow players.

Game: $2-$100 spread-limit Hold'em.

Hero: Stack of $500, have an aggressive, "Let's gamble!" image at the casino. A couple hours earlier I won my biggest pot by winning a flip (K5 against AJo on a J85x flop, all the money going in on the flop.) White, male, late 20s.

Villain: Asian in his early 20s. We've been butting heads, with very few hands going to showdown--I've tried to bluff him on the river twice and he responded by raising me. I won a big hand off him earlier by check-raising the maximum when I held the nuts on a KJ9xx board--he tanked for a few minutes, called, and mucked. In general, though, he's tough to read: Reasonably tight preflop, more aggressive postflop. He has a stack of $240.

HAND: Well, this is a boring one, because it's pretty standard. Villain limps under the gun, a couple others limp, I get to check Q8 in the Big Blind.

FLOP: Q74 ($8 pot)

I lead out for the pot, the Villain calls me.

TURN: 8 ($24 pot)

I bet $18, the Villain calls me.

RIVER: 3 ($60 pot)

A lot of options, what's the best one?

Thanks.
Top two pair out of the Big Blind, river is scare card Quote
05-09-2013 , 10:31 PM
Bet $45 on turn, probably fold to a raise.

In this situation, I wouldn't be worried about the flush until the villain tells you to be. In this situation, especially since you two just got into a big hand, he could easily have just a queen here.

A raise on the river from the villain is more likely to mean that he hit a set, the flush on the river. or the straight on the turn than he is value betting a worse two pair.
Top two pair out of the Big Blind, river is scare card Quote
05-09-2013 , 10:54 PM
Never leading out pot from the BB multiway with TPWK in a limped pot, especially with an aggressive villain with history still to act.

Debating between c/f and b/f for river... I think c/f.
Top two pair out of the Big Blind, river is scare card Quote
05-13-2013 , 05:19 PM
My friends argued that my hand is too strong to fold, and that check-calling nets the most profit (it allows him to bet his bluffs and his thin value hands <eg QJ, 78, etc>)...bet-folding (which is what I actually did) is just pissing money away.

No?
Top two pair out of the Big Blind, river is scare card Quote
05-13-2013 , 05:43 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by davomalvolio
My friends argued that my hand is too strong to fold, and that check-calling nets the most profit (it allows him to bet his bluffs and his thin value hands <eg QJ, 78, etc>)...bet-folding (which is what I actually did) is just pissing money away.

No?
Your friends are ******s. His calling range is wider than his betting range. He's never raising worse two pairs for value on this river card when you bet, so you can be comfortable bet folding. Tbh there aren't many two pairs in his range, he's heavily weighted towards TP and flushes.

I elected c/f because I feel there is very few hands worse than you that will call on this river, but he can easily have you beat. Not very many bluffs unless he decides to turn a Q into a bluff (much more likely to check it back imo).

Just what I felt about the hand.

Betting flop is a mistake though, make sure you understand that.
Top two pair out of the Big Blind, river is scare card Quote
05-13-2013 , 08:45 PM
Betting flop is probably a mistake always, especially in a spread limit game. Your bloating up the pot, and eventually it will get to the point where your $100 bet will be too small to have any fold equity. So really, with a weak made hand, you just want to keep the pot small.

As played, b/f river for $45.

After checking the flop (assuming no one else bet), I would bet the turn for 3/2 pot, and obviously 3B.

I like B/F the river for 3/4 pot.
Top two pair out of the Big Blind, river is scare card Quote
05-13-2013 , 11:40 PM
Grunch

I probably bet/fold $35 unless you have got some read that he would bluff raise the river.
Top two pair out of the Big Blind, river is scare card Quote
05-13-2013 , 11:45 PM
Wait what? Betting the flop is a mistake? How? All kinds of garbage will call a flop bet, 7x, 4x, 56, gutter's like 86, flush draws. Can some one please elaborate on why they think that betting the flop is a mistake? I would make the claim that not betting the flop is a mistake.
Top two pair out of the Big Blind, river is scare card Quote
05-24-2013 , 01:36 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by ThaNEWPr0fess0r
Grunch

I probably bet/fold $35 unless you have got some read that he would bluff raise the river.
Well, that's exactly what I did. I bet $35, he raised to $135 and I mucked.
Top two pair out of the Big Blind, river is scare card Quote

      
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