Casino $1/$2 game, just switched tables and this is my 4th hand. I have played all 3 of my first 3 hands, winning two of them without showdown and one of the folks at the table (not villain) has commented loudly that I “raise every hand”. I am an early 30s skinny WG and villain is prob late 30s overweight WG wearing sunglasses.

I wake up w/QQ OTB facing 3 limps. I bump it up to $15 and villain is UTG limper and 3-bets me to $55. My remaining stack is $220 and he covers.

Is this too deep to jam? I have no clue if this guy would really limp AA/KK UTG, but I’ve heard some guys like to do this. Really seems weird though. Thoughts on if calling or jamming is better here? I’ll share results afterwards.

Just call in position.

If I just call, my SPR on the flop will be like 1.5 and I’ll just have to stack off on all non-A or K flops, right?

My concern with this line is that AK, JJ and TT can all just c/f unless they hit and AA-KK can c-bet and basically force me all-in anyway. At least if I jam I can fold out AK (or have a slight edge if called) or maybe he sometimes looks me up with JJ because of my image. If I’m mostly going broke against AA and KK on the flop anyway then I might as well try to get some value from AK and the under pairs while they still look their best, right? Flop will often bring overcards to a J or T and scare them off.

Pretty tough spot.

Normally, i’d snap fold this 100% but the fact that youve raised 3 hands in a row changes things a little bit. People adjust by 1) waiting for the nuts to trap you or 2) spewing back. It’s hard to say which one he’s doing since you dont have much reads.

I think this is going to boil down to a live read. Does he seem comfortable, fidgety, blank stare? It’s hard to make this decision without any reads or being at the table.

But i do think shoving will be a little better than flatting IP. Not sure if shoving or fold is better

Fistpump jam.

This.

I’m in the fold camp. People just don’t adjust enough to make me believe they’re l/rr worse than AA/KK UTG. But I’ve seen people do it with TT/JJ/AK a few times. Although I do think those hands would raise slightly bigger out of fear.

I would call and see the flop. Honestly, for 1/2 that's a large 3! i think it's correct and i'd make it 50 myself in his shoes but most of those guys 3! to 35 or 40 there. For many 1/2 guys i know they 3! only with QQ and up. So folding is possible too. He may be doing this--given the verbal exchange--to have you fold and then show something like 10s or AK. I'd call here.

Basic gameflow. This is Hero's fourth raise in a row. He has literally raised every pot at the table and is a young skinny WG. The potential for spaz "not gonna let this kid push me around" is off the charts here.

This was my thinking/live read as well. I felt I looked super aggro raising the 3rd straight hand here and only my 4th at the table.

To be clear about the first 3 hands though, the first hand I called $7 so I didn’t raise it pre. But then I bet flop and took it down. Next two hands I did raise pre, once to $20 against a straddle and limp and took it down pre and the other I raised to $10 and got called and then c-bet flop and got called and folded on turn to a river jam from a short stack. So the QQ is my 3rd straight preflop raise and I’ve played all 4 hands at the table, but one I called a raise pre.

which could be an argument for call and call down basically any rundown...

but agree with you, there is no way I´m not looking for the best scenario to gii here, be it preflop or call him down if he appears to be weak.

my default is to jam too, even if he was just spazzraising with something like AT or 88 he might still be tilted enough to call it off or would get supertilted if he had to fold and the dynamics of the table could be off the charts for quite some time.

In no way I´m looking to fold here though, OP, if he´s lucky enough to have it just reload. Dream scenario imo

They dont adjust tho. That is one of the magical gifts that we recieve from live poker. If we are willing to accept it.

Do you have any read on V? Is it an OMC or a YAG? Clearly these aren't totally reliable, but I would be very reluctant to shove here vs an OMC whereas if it were younger player who "looked" decent, then I think shove is by far the best play given gameflow as Cheese said.

Really? I just saw this situation last Friday night. Guy couldn't wait to get it in with 88 pre thinking it was the nuts vs the "maniac" Guy had AA obv.

The 88 limped utg and 3 bet got it in.

Very little read on villain as it was my 4th hand. The sunglasses did give him the look of a guy who thinks he’s better than he really is. Like who wears sunglasses at $1/$2??? My only read was that my image was super aggro and that limp 3-bet was not anything I had ever seen anyone do at $1/$2 that I could recall. This made me feel like it might be something like 66 that just got frustrated and said screw this guy, I’m sick of him raising my limps.

Sorry I missed the descrip in your OP. Given that, I probably shove and live with the result.

I am interested to see the results

Ok results, you're going to LOVE this. Mindblowing.

So I deliberate for probably 20-30 seconds and then jam. He snap calls, but won't show. Run-out is T86, 4, 7 and he flips over 59 offsuit for a straight. GG

I mean, I can understand getting pissed off and 3-betting air to try and punish an overly aggressive player...but how do you CALL when they shove?!?!?!

Anyway no worries I'll take the action, but thought preflop was interesting because limp 3-betting is not something I had seen before so wasn't too sure on the correct strategy against it.

I do think you've gotta play it as I did given my image, but what do you guys think is the play if you just have a regular TAG image? I could almost see an argument for folding pre if the villain has been reasonably tight.

Gonna fix my own post here after seeing results. Good grief, sometimes the poker Gods have a nasty sense of humor. Sons of bitches.

As a TAG, not sure it changes that much as it really depends on the V in question as well as the dynamic (did you raise 3 of 4 hands before this one). One thing to keep in mind is that most players at this level have very short term memories and fixate on the last few hands so regardless of how you play (even if you were a Nit like GG), someone might try something like this on you just because you might have been dealt 4 premiums in 5 hands.

This is uber gross. But it goes to show that they absolutely DO adjust. It's fairly easy to get the average 1/2 table to adjust in just one orbit of play. After 3 or 4 hands someone will comment and then you know the table is about to lean in your direction. This is the dream scenario turned nightmare. At least we were under 200 BB deep, not much of a silver lining I know, I tried.

I saw a 2/5 reg nit do this and show me pre flop (I was sitting next to him). The 3! was not a limp raise though and came from OOP from an action player in one of the blinds. I thought it was tragic not to see a flop with QQ for a standard $25 open > $80 ish raise but maybe I'm missing something. When is it good / ok to fold QQ pre?

I see it all the time too but not at a high enough frequency to justify getting it in.

There is always a spazz factor. Its like 5%. In situations like these maybe its as high as 10%. The rest of the time its the nuts.

+1 to what Ava is saying in this thread,hitting the bullseye and got me out of the woods for once this summertime.

It never stops to amuse me though what he is saying. 95 percent of the time people just have the nutted hand they have been waiting for,no matter how crazy you have been playing. They just isnt adjusting to shyt.

Adjust isnt even in vocabulary to majority of low stakes players. You can raise their limps 10 times in a row, but when they finally fight back they show up with QQ+ like always. Or you can isolate raise the same player and C-bet the flop heads up against him 10 times in a row him folding everytime. If he eventually raises your flop C-bet, he is not widening his range raising you with a draw or a middle pair: no, he just finally managed to hit 2 pair+ on the flop.

It is a true gift for sure, if you can learn to accept it as it is as mentioned-instead of readjusting to something that is not there 95 percent of the time or wish that the reality was otherwise due to ego purposes.

I would estimate that accepting this reality+ learning to live with it and doing the neccesary plays (often making a strong fold,but also sometimes betting or raising) in alot of situations have been one of my biggest edges in livepoker through the years ive been playing and contributes _alot_ to my winrate.

Grunch: he's been perfectly set up with the previous raises, and now thinks you're FOS. This is an absolute dream spot. Now high five dealer and jam!!

Wow, the guy had 59o and we're still talking about how no one ever adjusts and there's at most a 10% spaz factor. As if we have enough data points on LRR against a perceived maniac to conclude it's KK+ 90% (the two data points itt where it was 88 and 59o must be extreme outliers, even though Ava admittedly "sees it all the time" - so do I).

Could be wrong, but maybe what's happening here is that people are taking "90% of players won't adjust" and extrapolating from that to conclude we're beat 90% of the time facing this LRR, which is faulty logic.

Consider an extreme world where 98% of players will LRR this spot exactly and only with KK+, while 2% are maniacs that will LRR this spot with 50% of holdings. Then, the probability that we're up against KK+ when we get LRR by an unknown is less than half (I calculate about 48% to be precise).

In reality, it's probably more like a spectrum, with most not LRRing wider than KK+, some regs who will LRR QQ+/AK, others who will LRR TT+, AQ+, and looser fish / tilters who will LRR very wide, such as Villain in the OP. The point remains though that even if the group that LRR's worse than KK+ is much much smaller than the group that LRR's only KK+, it can still be +EV to shove.

Well everyone who says "they don't adjust" is right. They absolutely don't adjust like they should. Instead, "they" think you're FOS and get ready to get into a testosterone fueled "my deck is bigger than yours, I'll show you what I can do with my chips too" peeing match. This happens all the time at every casino. That's why it's a dream spot. Think of your history hands as tapping the ketchup bottle. It's now ready to explode, don't fold now and waste your perfect chance.

If I'm being totally honest I seek out these spots and I individually keep track of how much I've tapped each of my opponents ketchup bottles (as much as I can).