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thoughts on flopped 2 pair and contracted fancy play syndrome thoughts on flopped 2 pair and contracted fancy play syndrome

04-24-2017 , 10:34 AM
2/4/8 with $1 ante home game

Villain is a regular thinking player at the game. Just lost a large 3-way all-in hand with the second nut flush to hero's nut flush. May be a little tilted, but seems pretty solid overall.

Hero has made several advertisement plays, showing bluffs almost every other hand. Very loose and fishy image.

Hero stack at 3.1k raises UTG with 75dd to 25, CO, and V (1.6k) on button calls.

9d7h5c pot 90

Hero checks, CO bets 45, V calls, and Hero x/r to 230.
CO folds and V calls.

Turn comes Qh pot 920

Hero check calls V's 230

River 6c

Hero bets out 180, V tanks 10 seconds and raises to 440.

Hero?

Really looking for thoughts on the river as played.

Last edited by pk8914; 04-24-2017 at 10:54 AM. Reason: change title
thoughts on flopped 2 pair and contracted fancy play syndrome Quote
04-24-2017 , 11:13 AM
Not a fan of the flop checkraise, you're making the pot pretty big and this hand is going to be tough to play on a lot of runouts. Checkraise/bet/bet seems like a line where the river bet doesn't get called by worse.

Just bet the turn.

Have no idea what the river lead is intended to accomplish. I'd check and am probably check folding a lot, although hand reading villain is tough given his weird turn bet.
thoughts on flopped 2 pair and contracted fancy play syndrome Quote
04-24-2017 , 11:36 AM
How is the pot $920 on the turn?

$75 pre + $505 flop + blinds and ante = $600ish depending on rake.

Asking because the bet of $230 feels pretty different if it is 25% of pot v. 45%.

River is tough. You are calling $260 to win either $1,500 or $1,200 (ish). V doesn't have to show up with many bluffs or A9 to make that profitable, so as played, I think you sort of have to pay the rent to visit valuetown and call.

But I agree about the x/r comment: the pot is bloated and awkward.
thoughts on flopped 2 pair and contracted fancy play syndrome Quote
04-24-2017 , 11:52 AM
i dont like this hand except pre haha but it might be very good way to win money VS this guy.

I like pre but I open a lot pre and im sure that is a huge leak of mine.

Flop-im gonna rep an OP basically and take a bet bet bet line with bottom 2 vs this guy and our image. unless they calling you down light as **** cause you been bluffing and showing and splashing around. then i like the c/r.

As Played- again all depends on my thoughts of what villain thinks of me, I cant see hwo you can c/r then check the turn. IDK now Im lost. Once I get htis lost in a ahnd Ill revert down to c/c cheap bets and thats exactly what I would do.

If this was all FPS to take the wonkiest most exploitative line and get paid then congrats. If this is a std hand vs std Villain i think I would have played almsot every street post different.
thoughts on flopped 2 pair and contracted fancy play syndrome Quote
04-24-2017 , 12:11 PM
Pot on the turn isn't 920: 90 + 45 + 230 + 230 is 595

I don't hate the flop x/r, but I'd just lead out for 100. It's bad if the flop gets checked through and the x/r looks stronger than the lead. I want to use our fishy image to keep their ranges wide. I think bet, bet, bet does that better than x/r, bet, bet. Furthermore, there are a lot of turn cards that may make me decide I'm not committed after all.

I'm lost on the turn. The Q is basically a blank; why are we now slowing down? Presumably we x/r the flop to build a big pot with our fishy image and disguised hand. OK, let's keep doing that.

Pot on the river is over 1K. We bet 180? I'm lost again.

We have a weak, bluffy image and bet 18% of the pot on the river. Now a thinking player has raised a tiny amount. He could be bluffing here; he could be sucking us in. I guess we have to call 'cause our play has been so weird and there's some chance this is a bluff designed to look like a value min(ish) raise. But we're very likely to be beat and donating 440 we didn't absolutely have to.

I can't find a plan you were following for the hand. The flop x/r looks like you're gunning to get it all in, but then you check the turn and dribble the river. If you're getting it all in, great. Do that. If you don't want to play for stacks with bottom 2P, great. Do that. But don't build a big pot and then abandon it.
thoughts on flopped 2 pair and contracted fancy play syndrome Quote
04-24-2017 , 01:36 PM
Fold pre, lead flop, lead turn, check river. I don't see how you beat villains value range here. Villains line looks like a set to me. If you think he could have a slow played AA/KK, then I guess you can call. I doubt he has enough bluffs here, the missed straight draws have pairs, maybe he could bluff something like JTs, but the river raise really looks like value. I wouldn't recommend trying to bluff him off his set.
thoughts on flopped 2 pair and contracted fancy play syndrome Quote
04-24-2017 , 01:43 PM
Way too loose to open pre, this is insanely wide UTG

Leading the flop looks better than check/raising to me

On the turn, it looks more bluffy for you to continue your story by leading rather than checking again and giving them a chance to check back.
thoughts on flopped 2 pair and contracted fancy play syndrome Quote
04-24-2017 , 02:02 PM
Pre is just bad, dont x/r flop it's just FPS, barrel turn, x/decide river, AP lol pot odds call
thoughts on flopped 2 pair and contracted fancy play syndrome Quote
04-24-2017 , 03:02 PM
With the antes open to around $35-$40 pre, but with this hand just fold. From UTG J9s is usually the first gapper I consider playing if I want to loosen up.
thoughts on flopped 2 pair and contracted fancy play syndrome Quote
04-24-2017 , 03:07 PM
If you check turn, then check/shove this bet sizing IMO.

No idea what you were doing on river. Probably gonna check/fold to a large bet.

I've convinced myself many times that I could open a hand like 57s UTG and make it profitable, but it just ain't so. Although I still do this stuff on occasion, I know that the advice is right - Fold pre.
thoughts on flopped 2 pair and contracted fancy play syndrome Quote

      
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