Two Plus Two Publishing LLC
Two Plus Two Publishing LLC
 

Go Back   Two Plus Two Poker Forums > >

Notices

Live Low-stakes NL Discussion of up to 3/5 live no-limit, pot-limit and spread-limit Texas Hold'em poker games, situations and strategies.

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 01-05-2019, 03:30 AM   #26
PFunkaliscious
veteran
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Posts: 3,064
Re: Thats a big bet, Sir

blech. he could be as weak as bottom two. but more likely he has either a set or the bottom straight.

call and run it twice.
PFunkaliscious is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-05-2019, 05:15 AM   #27
monikrazy
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
monikrazy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 26,712
Re: Thats a big bet, Sir

Edit: misread the hand, shrug-calling at this point
monikrazy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-05-2019, 10:05 AM   #28
MikeStarr
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
Join Date: Jan 2016
Posts: 7,978
Re: Thats a big bet, Sir

I called. He had 6h3h. We ran twice

First river was Kd
Second river was some brick and we chopped.

With a straight and a flush redraw, this has to be one of the worst bets ever (although I did call so whatever). I had one of the very few hands I would ever call with. The sick thing is if he makes an actual good bet...like $200....I call and river the K and bust him for a huge pot so his horrible bet saved his ass this time.
MikeStarr is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-05-2019, 01:45 PM   #29
Javanewt
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: a farm in the country
Posts: 10,522
Re: Thats a big bet, Sir

I kinda think you are the on who got lucky
Javanewt is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-05-2019, 02:15 PM   #30
venice10
Referee
 
venice10's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Nowhere special
Posts: 24,473
Re: Thats a big bet, Sir

Quote:
Originally Posted by Javanewt View Post
I kinda think you are the on who got lucky
Yeah, that's some massive results orientated thinking. I wouldn't try to make myself feel better by thinking, "well, he played bad on this hand, too." The villain made it clear that he wasn't going to pay you off if you were ever going to be ahead in this hand.
venice10 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-05-2019, 03:05 PM   #31
Avaritia
Confirmed 2500 hour haver
 
Avaritia's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Florida
Posts: 12,215
Re: Thats a big bet, Sir

Quote:
Originally Posted by canadiasian View Post
99% chance it is 8h6h.

1% chance it is 86.
Pretty sick read guy
Avaritia is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-05-2019, 03:26 PM   #32
josofo
grinder
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Posts: 610
Re: Thats a big bet, Sir

Quote:
Originally Posted by Minatorr View Post
I would check flop

Ap turn i call, he has some worse value here once every blue moon and folding would be a huge disaster, we have way too many outs even vs the nuts. your perceived range here is very weak here as well (although you should have a lot of monsters flatting flop x/r).

we have 4 out vs a straight, with one card to come. this is not way too many outs.

i have called in these spots before (not with this big of an overbet) and it usually doesn't work out to well. don't go broke in a limp pot without the nuts.
(edit)
i missed that we have the heart draw. yeah this spot really sucks. probably have to call
josofo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-05-2019, 05:33 PM   #33
wait
banned
 
Join Date: Oct 2017
Posts: 1,115
Re: Thats a big bet, Sir

It's definitely a fold based on results and the read you should have on this guy.
wait is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-05-2019, 05:41 PM   #34
nonoyoker
enthusiast
 
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 55
Re: Thats a big bet, Sir

Quote:
Originally Posted by MikeStarr View Post
I called. He had 6h3h. We ran twice

First river was Kd
Second river was some brick and we chopped.

With a straight and a flush redraw, this has to be one of the worst bets ever (although I did call so whatever). I had one of the very few hands I would ever call with. The sick thing is if he makes an actual good bet...like $200....I call and river the K and bust him for a huge pot so his horrible bet saved his ass this time.
Why are you running it twice here? Very bad spot for that
nonoyoker is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-05-2019, 05:47 PM   #35
browni3141
Pooh-Bah
 
Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: South Florida
Posts: 4,829
Re: Thats a big bet, Sir

Quote:
Originally Posted by nonoyoker View Post
Why are you running it twice here? Very bad spot for that
RIT is EV neutral. If you donít believe me do a search for one of the many threads about it.
browni3141 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-05-2019, 05:51 PM   #36
Havick
journeyman
 
Havick's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2018
Location: Las Vegas Nevada
Posts: 389
Re: Thats a big bet, Sir

"Probably have to call" when villain (almost) 3x pots?

While we do have heart outs, it's not that many, because villain has 2 in his hand and the 2h is dirty. So real time there's 10 outs, and theoretically theres 13 if villain isn't on the nfd, which he probably isn't.

Villain bets $600 into $225.

I won't math that the whole way, but there's no way calling is +EV with this villain as described.
Havick is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-05-2019, 05:54 PM   #37
Havick
journeyman
 
Havick's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2018
Location: Las Vegas Nevada
Posts: 389
Re: Thats a big bet, Sir

I think that's what he meant at the bottom.
Havick is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-05-2019, 06:45 PM   #38
MikeStarr
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
Join Date: Jan 2016
Posts: 7,978
Re: Thats a big bet, Sir

Quote:
Originally Posted by nonoyoker View Post
Why are you running it twice here? Very bad spot for that
I always run it twice unless the other guy doesnt want to. I dont pick and choose. That's horrible etiquette
MikeStarr is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-05-2019, 07:11 PM   #39
Javanewt
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: a farm in the country
Posts: 10,522
Re: Thats a big bet, Sir

Guys, it is 9 outs. The 8 of Hearts is bad for us too.
Javanewt is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-05-2019, 07:16 PM   #40
Havick
journeyman
 
Havick's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2018
Location: Las Vegas Nevada
Posts: 389
Re: Thats a big bet, Sir

Quote:
Originally Posted by Javanewt View Post
Guys, it is 9 outs. The 8 of Hearts is bad for us too.
How's that?

Villain holds 3h6h hero has the 7h. Or did I misread that?
Havick is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-05-2019, 07:19 PM   #41
Javanewt
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: a farm in the country
Posts: 10,522
Re: Thats a big bet, Sir

Sorry. Read it wrong. 10.

Last edited by Javanewt; 01-05-2019 at 07:25 PM.
Javanewt is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-05-2019, 07:55 PM   #42
wj94
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: Las Vegas
Posts: 7,695
Re: Thats a big bet, Sir

Don't go broke in a limped pot without the nuts.
wj94 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-05-2019, 08:38 PM   #43
MikeStarr
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
Join Date: Jan 2016
Posts: 7,978
Re: Thats a big bet, Sir

Quote:
Originally Posted by wait View Post
It's definitely a fold based on results and the read you should have on this guy.
Gotta love this little nugget
MikeStarr is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-05-2019, 08:40 PM   #44
wait
banned
 
Join Date: Oct 2017
Posts: 1,115
Re: Thats a big bet, Sir

Quote:
Originally Posted by MikeStarr View Post
Gotta love this little nugget
Not a joke bud. If he's spazzing this hard with a straight and flush draw then no shot he does this with 2 pair or a set or nfd. Good thing you picked all this up previously tho.
wait is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-05-2019, 08:51 PM   #45
MikeStarr
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
Join Date: Jan 2016
Posts: 7,978
Re: Thats a big bet, Sir

Quote:
Originally Posted by wait View Post
Not a joke bud. If he's spazzing this hard with a straight and flush draw then no shot he does this with 2 pair or a set or nfd. Good thing you picked all this up previously tho.
You have no idea whether or not he would do it with 2 pair and neither do I. We rarely see anyone jam $600 into a $225 pot and even more rarely ever see a bet like that get called. Its too rare of an event to know what one player would or wouldn't do it with.

Last week a saw I $20 raise and then a guy 3 bet jammed $750 in preflop with 95s. I doubt anyone expected to see that hand at showdown.

But that point of my post was that the "results" have nothing to do with it being a fold or not.
MikeStarr is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-05-2019, 08:57 PM   #46
mikko
veteran
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 2,863
Re: Thats a big bet, Sir

Think it is fairly safe to say it wasn't 2 pair. Have seen noobs spazz Nut flush draw in this spot though.
mikko is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-06-2019, 12:56 AM   #47
wait
banned
 
Join Date: Oct 2017
Posts: 1,115
Re: Thats a big bet, Sir

Quote:
Originally Posted by MikeStarr View Post
You have no idea whether or not he would do it with 2 pair and neither do I. We rarely see anyone jam $600 into a $225 pot and even more rarely ever see a bet like that get called. Its too rare of an event to know what one player would or wouldn't do it with.

Last week a saw I $20 raise and then a guy 3 bet jammed $750 in preflop with 95s. I doubt anyone expected to see that hand at showdown.

But that point of my post was that the "results" have nothing to do with it being a fold or not.
Cool story no one cares. Is it the same villain as this hand? No. If this guy from your imaginary story was the one shoving then it's a snap call based on the results of the 95s hand. I guarantee next time this exact spot comes up vs this guy you'll fold because of the results bud.
wait is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-06-2019, 01:07 AM   #48
Havick
journeyman
 
Havick's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2018
Location: Las Vegas Nevada
Posts: 389
Re: Thats a big bet, Sir

Quote:
Originally Posted by MikeStarr View Post
You have no idea whether or not he would do it with 2 pair and neither do I. We rarely see anyone jam $600 into a $225 pot and even more rarely ever see a bet like that get called. Its too rare of an event to know what one player would or wouldn't do it with.

Last week a saw I $20 raise and then a guy 3 bet jammed $750 in preflop with 95s. I doubt anyone expected to see that hand at showdown.

But that point of my post was that the "results" have nothing to do with it being a fold or not.
By "results" the implication is that now you have a viable history with this SPECIFIC villain to fold in this spot in the future. Not "results" in the sense that because this HAND didn't work out, so you fold every time a villain overbet jams.

If you aren't building a history with villain based on the "results" of the way he played, you're wrong and it's a leak in your game.
Havick is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-06-2019, 03:27 AM   #49
ABCforME
journeyman
 
Join Date: Jul 2016
Posts: 203
Re: Thats a big bet, Sir

This is in the long run an obvious flopped straight of which there are 32 combinations. If he had 63 offsuit I would perceive this player type to bet the turn as well after your flop just call.

These businessmen type players are exactly the ones to shove all in for value in spots they know opponents will have a hard time folding in.

Players who are capable of overbet jams without the nuts are usually super aggressive in lots of spots which doesn’t seem to match him.

I think you should focus on your results oriented thinking as stated by others and what is causing that (switch to ignition so you can get more hands in and can care less about big once a day pots live?) as well as how he only needs one combo of a hand worse than you per three hands stronger to make this a profitable call. So you called correctly given your reads on him at the time.

Last edited by ABCforME; 01-06-2019 at 03:36 AM.
ABCforME is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-07-2019, 01:36 PM   #50
c0rnBr34d
old hand
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 1,250
Re: Thats a big bet, Sir

I thought it was the nut straight for sure but the smaller straight with the flush re-draw just in case someone else has the nut straight (which V partially blocks) also makes sense. V also blocks the flush draw if anyone else is drawing. It's pretty sick how strong he is here and that overplaying it saved his stack. There are a class of players that overprotect huge hands but I haven't seen it to this magnitude at 2/5. He probably gets calls more than we would think at 1/2 and 1/3 with just pair + flush draws or even naked nut flush draws making it less terrible. Thanks for sharing though as I agree this spot is super rare at live 2/5.
c0rnBr34d is offline   Reply With Quote

Reply
      

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off


Forum Jump


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 02:47 AM.


Powered by vBulletin®
Copyright ©2000 - 2021, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright © 2008-2020, Two Plus Two Interactive