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Old 01-11-2018, 07:34 PM   #26
ninefingershuffle
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Re: Suited Ace vs 2 villains

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Originally Posted by whs1919 View Post
If we cbet how much are we making it?

H call 20.

Turn ($96) Qh. H checks, V1 makes it 25, V2 calls. Hero?
You are getting great odds to call at hit
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Old 01-11-2018, 08:14 PM   #27
whs1919
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Re: Suited Ace vs 2 villains

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I agree but same effect in play after an hour imo.
Yea I get that but I am still not going to do it with any two cards. I have preflop ranges, and I am not going to throw those out the window because I haven't had any cards to play in the last two hours.

I mean yeah I look like a nit, but sometimes that is the way the cards fall. I am not going to open junk just to up my hand count. Also I am not calling preflop with junk to do the same.

I literally saw the same type of offsuit hands for the 2 hours. I think I got AJ offsuit once and the pot was 3bet before it got to me in late position so I folded.
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Old 01-11-2018, 08:58 PM   #28
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Re: Suited Ace vs 2 villains

To be fair to EJXD2, if someone is observed not playing a single hand even for a limp for two hours it’s far more likely they are playing too tight than just card dead.
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Old 01-11-2018, 09:08 PM   #29
whs1919
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Re: Suited Ace vs 2 villains

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To be fair to EJXD2, if someone is observed not playing a single hand even for a limp for two hours itís far more likely they are playing too tight than just card dead.
Yea definitely could be. But it wasn't the case.

I mean have you guys really never been card dead for longer than two hours at a live full ring nl holdem game, were you are getting maybe 30 hands per hr? Honest question.

And if you haven't can you please list your opening ranges, and calling ranges from positions, because maybe my ranges are to tight.
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Old 01-11-2018, 09:22 PM   #30
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Re: Suited Ace vs 2 villains

Getting junk for two hours happens all the time, but you should still find some speculative junk to play the occasional button with. You don’t want to pick up KK after folding for two hours only to have the table fold.

I’m not gonna comment on flop cuz that was a dumpster fire but I like turn *assuming* you’re not trying to make somebody fold Kx. The play is fairly FPS because you’re really only repping KK and these guys might not even be paying attention but whatever.

This hand and by extension your range vs. their range would have played better as a c-bet and double barrel. Q is literally turning gin. Gives you all kinds of outs and there are blockers to Kx all over the place now. I’d be betting the turn fairly large now. 15 outs vs. K9-K2, 18 outs vs. a pair below T’s (ex-T7).
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Old 01-12-2018, 11:46 AM   #31
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Re: Suited Ace vs 2 villains

If I've been card dead and haven't played a hand in a few orbits, I will raise IP with almost ATC, sometimes w/o looking, and use my image. It rarely gets past the flop (if it even goes to the flop), I win a few bucks, and I can sit back and wait/watch for a while longer.
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Old 01-12-2018, 12:25 PM   #32
whs1919
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Re: Suited Ace vs 2 villains

Yeah I get what you guys are saying. But there was just nothing worth playing given the circumstance. I mean I don't mind opening a one off hand randomly every half an hour if you guys are saying do that in order to not look so nitty. What is a profitable range to open? The only thing is almost all flops are going multi way, so I feel like raising ATC for image is just lighting that money on fire and I am not really getting anything back.

For what its worth I only stayed for another hour and ended up playing 5-6 more hands in that time. For that hour is it still to tight? 4 open raises in early position and 2 calls out of the bb.

Yes after looking at the flop play I was definitely trying to much FPS, which I can do sometimes, have to get a hold of that.

I agree on the cbet and barrel part. This is definitely the better option given how my range would hit the board. What cbet size, and turn size are you using? Haven't played live in awhile and most players were cbetting half pot or less.

If I cbet flop i would go 25 and the turn 85 assuming both players called flop.
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Old 01-12-2018, 12:29 PM   #33
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Re: Suited Ace vs 2 villains

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Originally Posted by Javanewt View Post
If I've been card dead and haven't played a hand in a few orbits, I will raise IP with almost ATC, sometimes w/o looking, and use my image. It rarely gets past the flop (if it even goes to the flop), I win a few bucks, and I can sit back and wait/watch for a while longer.
This is really table dependent. At loose aggro tables, this simply isn't going to work, cuz (a) far too good a chance the hand gets raised before you and (b) far too good a chance your raise doesn't thin the field enough for you to barrel thru the world postflop. And at these types of tables, I'm not sure you can play tight enough.

Basically, just play your game. ETA: i.e. I agree with OP regarding raising ATC just cuz we've been card dead for a while is lighting money on fire if it's likely to go multiway / very multiway.

GimoG
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Old 01-12-2018, 12:47 PM   #34
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Re: Suited Ace vs 2 villains

Yes, it is table dependent, but if I have been sitting at a table for a few orbits, I know the players well enough to know when/if this will work. Honestly, it usually does. If I play my hand like AA/KK or even AK, I get basically the same result as if I actually have them, but I don't get wedded to my hand and it's pretty simple to fold.

The beauty of not looking is that sometimes, when you are played back at, you can look at your hand and you've actually slammed the flop, which they never believe (because they put you on an over pair or AK). If you haven't, just fold and they'll think you had AK. I don't recommend this for everyone, but it works for me almost every time. I also realize there are a lot of nits on 2+2 who would not do this in a million years, but I'm not one of them (and I'm actually a tight player by most standards).

If you sit at a table for two hours w/o playing a hand, though, don't be surprised when your "playable" hand is cracked by 52
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Old 01-12-2018, 03:42 PM   #35
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Re: Suited Ace vs 2 villains

It doesn't have to be a raise. You can over limp something like 96o on the BTN. Just see a flop or two when you can and don't go crazy with one pair.
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Old 01-12-2018, 05:19 PM   #36
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Re: Suited Ace vs 2 villains

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It doesn't have to be a raise. You can over limp something like 96o on the BTN. Just see a flop or two when you can and don't go crazy with one pair.
True I will try this. Definitely better than folding for two hours, and less expensive than raising.
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Old 01-12-2018, 07:11 PM   #37
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Re: Suited Ace vs 2 villains

At a raisey table you often won't be given the opportunity to limp weak hands on the Button. But yeah, if the opportunity arises, I'm all for making a *small* mistake (if it is one at all) by seeing a flop in LP with 74o or whatever just so people realize I'm still at the table and playing hands other than AA.

GcluelessnonAAhandplayingnoobG
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Old 01-12-2018, 08:54 PM   #38
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Re: Suited Ace vs 2 villains

I think limping w/ 96 or 74 after not playing a hand for a few orbits is much worse than raising with them (or raising blind), but go for it. I try to never limp with those types of hands.

I would limp with 56, 78, etc., if there are a few limpers and I'm fairly certain nobody behind me is raising light.
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Old 01-12-2018, 11:39 PM   #39
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Re: Suited Ace vs 2 villains

We will only get BTN 6 times in 2 hours.

It's entirely possible (and very likely) that it gets to us unraised exactly 0/6 times.
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Old 01-13-2018, 12:59 AM   #40
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Re: Suited Ace vs 2 villains

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Originally Posted by Javanewt View Post
I think limping w/ 96 or 74 after not playing a hand for a few orbits is much worse than raising with them (or raising blind), but go for it. I try to never limp with those types of hands.

I would limp with 56, 78, etc., if there are a few limpers and I'm fairly certain nobody behind me is raising light.
I donít mean open limping MP or something ... Iím saying 2-3 limpets before you at a passive table where SB/BB never raise light - this is perfectly acceptable to overlimp light and look for trips, two pair or disguised OESDís.
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Old 01-13-2018, 03:05 AM   #41
whs1919
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Re: Suited Ace vs 2 villains

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I donít mean open limping MP or something ... Iím saying 2-3 limpets before you at a passive table where SB/BB never raise light - this is perfectly acceptable to overlimp light and look for trips, two pair or disguised OESDís.
Did this tonight got stacks in both time with the nuts.
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Old 01-13-2018, 03:32 AM   #42
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Re: Suited Ace vs 2 villains

I wouldn't check raise that flop. I think from a risk/reward standpoint what happens when they both call your reraise? You really don't have anything there except a backdoor flush draw.
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Old 01-13-2018, 12:00 PM   #43
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Re: Suited Ace vs 2 villains

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Did this tonight got stacks in both time with the nuts.
lol nice man

Bingo from the BTN
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Old 01-13-2018, 10:58 PM   #44
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Re: Suited Ace vs 2 villains

If I haven't played a hand in ages, I think I'd rather 3bet IP with 65o or some other reasonably playable trash hand, than just open with a similar hand.
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