Open Side Menu Go to the Top
Register
Straddle raising to 10X in the dark Straddle raising to 10X in the dark

06-20-2017 , 11:43 PM
Live 1/1/2.

Villain has 100Bb, straddles every time, and if it is limped back to him, he with make it $20 every single time without looking at his cards.

I have KJs.

He does this once more, and gets 2 callers with insanely deep stacks. I am on the button with KJs, 120BB. What would you do here? How do I exploit this play, and with what range of hands do I do it with? I know this is a very specific situation but it's weird and I was curious.
Straddle raising to 10X in the dark Quote
06-20-2017 , 11:46 PM
Overlimp. After he raises, fold if the earlier limpers raise, call in position if both call, and shove if neither/1 does.
Straddle raising to 10X in the dark Quote
06-21-2017 , 01:03 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by RawBeeG
Live 1/1/2.

Villain has 100Bb, straddles every time, and if it is limped back to him, he with make it $20 every single time without looking at his cards.

I have KJs.

He does this once more, and gets 2 callers with insanely deep stacks. I am on the button with KJs, 120BB. What would you do here? How do I exploit this play, and with what range of hands do I do it with? I know this is a very specific situation but it's weird and I was curious.
So there's 30BB in the pot already? If these callers are playing a ton of hands, I agree with Garick. Shove over the straddler unless both limpers call.

In that case you can also call with the intention of getting it in by the turn if you make TP or better. Top pair with KJ is normally pretty weak but in a straddled pot and 100BB stacks it's quite good.

This is because straddling halves the effective stacks. So straddling makes your effective stack 60BB, but if the straddler is literally raising every hand and people are adjusting by loosening up, then it kind of makes your effective stacks even shorter. The basic adjustment to this is to loosen up yourself, and to play more hands likely to make TPGK. Let's say in MP you'd normally play 16.44%: {22+, A2s+, KTs+, QTs+, JTs, T9s, 98s, 87s, 76s, 65s, AJo+, KQo} with a medium stack. You want to remove speculative hands like 22-55 and 65s and add hands like KJo and ATo. Your new range might be 21.12%: {77+, A2s+, K9s+, Q9s+, J9s+, T9s, 98s, 87s, 76s, A9o+, KTo+, QTo+, JTo}

You don't have to play this loose, and if you don't I'd remove the AXs and low SCs, maybe JTo, but let's say you have 100BB and there's a straddle. Now you have 50BB (basically). So you aren't trying to limp AXs and SCs to hit straights and draws. The shallower you get, the more AXs is valuable as top pair. You want to play speculative hands aggressively. If you flop a strong draw like flush draw + overs, or flush draw + gutshot, or pair + OESD, or nut flush draw + pair/overs, consider a check-raise all in on the flop. The shorter you are, the more you should play AXs and SCs like this.

As for the hands like KTo, with 100BB in an unstraddled pot this hand is quite weak in most positions, but with effective 50BB due to the straddle it becomes a playable hand. Raise it for value pre-flop, fire a C-bet if you miss and think it will work (don't do this if you have more than 2 opponents), and if you hit, bet the flop for value and shove the turn. You're still dominated by AK, KQ, and KJ, but you'll get called by worse, particularly the straddler, who will have all kinds of crap like K3o. And since you're fairly shallow, your reverse implied odds are low.

I don't know if you're familiar with SPR (stack to pot ratio) but if you are it may help to think in terms of that. Let's say you're in MP and UTG straddles. There's two limps and you raise to $20 (your raises should be about twice your normal raise size in straddled pots). One of the limpers and UTG calls. The pot on the flop is $67 and you have $180 behind. Your SPR is 2.68, which is excellent for a hand like KTo. If you make top pair, bet about $50, and you'll get called by worse quite often. Say then you have one caller on the turn. The pot is now $167 and you have $130 left. You should shove most turn cards. The main exception would be if the turn brings 4 to a straight or 4 to a flush or something like that. With SPRs this low, don't worry too much about somebody hitting a flush or straight unless they only need one card to do it.

Hope this helps. Just remember the main adjustment is to shift your range to more hands that make TPGK, drop the worst pocket pairs and SCs, and don't be afraid to get your stack in when you hit, even with a seemingly vulnerable hand like KT or AT. And remember with straddlers, particularly guys like this who frequently straddle-raise, you will be gambling a lot, so expect higher than normal variance, but try not to let it bother you, because players like this make the game really juicy if you know how to adjust.
Straddle raising to 10X in the dark Quote
06-21-2017 , 01:51 AM
Would just rip it in in LP or near LP, folding from EP
Straddle raising to 10X in the dark Quote
06-21-2017 , 02:18 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Minatorr
Would just rip it in in LP or near LP, folding from EP
So, tear up the cards and throw them at the straddler? I like it.

Oh wait, you meant shove. Too many synonyms for all-in. You know I once said "I shove" while going all-in and the dealer was like "what?"
Straddle raising to 10X in the dark Quote
06-21-2017 , 02:27 AM
Wow thanks for such an in depth answer. I actually did just shove even with the two callers because they just limp called and are pretty bad, probably didn't even notice the straddler's strategy. Stacked him twice like this for a pretty nice day.
Straddle raising to 10X in the dark Quote
06-21-2017 , 02:42 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shai Hulud
So, tear up the cards and throw them at the straddler? I like it.

Oh wait, you meant shove. Too many synonyms for all-in. You know I once said "I shove" while going all-in and the dealer was like "what?"
Lmfaoo
Straddle raising to 10X in the dark Quote
06-21-2017 , 11:41 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shai Hulud
So, tear up the cards and throw them at the straddler? I like it.

Oh wait, you meant shove. Too many synonyms for all-in. You know I once said "I shove" while going all-in and the dealer was like "what?"
LOL! In a home game, back in early 2000s, bet was $60 & I announced raise & then put the $60 in & dealer said "$60 raise" claiming I can only min-raise.

But then, this was same guy who was willing to bet me Egypt wasn't in Africa until a buddy of his saved him.
Straddle raising to 10X in the dark Quote
06-22-2017 , 04:28 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by ZuneIt
LOL! In a home game, back in early 2000s, bet was $60 & I announced raise & then put the $60 in & dealer said "$60 raise" claiming I can only min-raise.

But then, this was same guy who was willing to bet me Egypt wasn't in Africa until a buddy of his saved him.
LOL...people are so bad with geography. Totally off topic but I saw this National Geographic study that showed like half of Americans can't find the UK on a map. Sad but true.

I always try to get people to bet me when they're "totally sure" about something ridiculous but they never do. Like this guy who swore up and down to me that dinosaurs weren't reptiles but suddenly started talking about how he didn't believe in gambling when I said we'd look it up and I'd give him 100:1 odds on his bet if they weren't reptiles. LOL.

Another time this racist idiot was talking about how blacks were overtaking whites in Oregon by population. Said he read in the paper there were already more black people than white people in Oregon. This guy LIVES in Oregon. He said this in a room with zero black people, IN OREGON. I started cracking up and offered him 100:1 he was wrong, and that Oregon was no more than 2-3% black, but he just didn't believe me, because I mean, he read it in a paper, or well, he thought he did, but I'd honestly be surprised he could read. Finally somebody in the room looked it up on his phone and obviously I was correct. I did get to embarrass the guy, but I can never get money from these guys...if I could I'd be rich by now.

Haha. so...to get back to the hand. SPR and stuff. Yeah.
Straddle raising to 10X in the dark Quote
06-22-2017 , 08:49 AM
Shai Hulud! You're giving too good of odds! You need to lower them to make it appear you're not sure........."I don't think you're right there, buddy. Tell you what, I'll give you $500 to your $100, if you're right....Yeah, 5:1. I have $500...."

Works for question: Are there more stars in the galaxy than trees on earth. You say galaxy, they hear/think universe.
Straddle raising to 10X in the dark Quote
06-22-2017 , 09:23 AM
Trivial squeeze shove with $60 in dead money out there.
Straddle raising to 10X in the dark Quote
06-22-2017 , 03:35 PM
in this spot I'm shoving all day. If EP had hands they would've rr themselves. wp
Straddle raising to 10X in the dark Quote
06-22-2017 , 05:06 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by ZuneIt
Shai Hulud! You're giving too good of odds! You need to lower them to make it appear you're not sure........."I don't think you're right there, buddy. Tell you what, I'll give you $500 to your $100, if you're right....Yeah, 5:1. I have $500...."
I actually do start the odds low. With the dinosaur guy it went something like this (we were playing hangman for some reason and my clue was "ancient type of reptile" the answer to which was dinosaur, which nobody got right, and this particular dude argued it wasn't fair since dinosaurs aren't reptiles.

"Pretty sure dinosaurs are repitles, buddy."
"No they're not!! Cuz...I read something about it recently"
"Well I'll bet you $20 you're wrong. We can look it up now."
"Ehrmm...well...uh...I don't like to gamble."
"But it's not gambling. I mean you're 100% sure, right?"
"Absolutely 100%!"
"So let's make the bet. I'll even give you to 2:1 odds"
(I have to explain what odds mean)
"Well... it still seems wrong. I don't want to get money involved"
.................... (this continues a while)
"Tell you what, we look this up in the encylopedia of your choice, and if dinosaurs are not reptiles, I'll give you $1000, and if they are, you give me $10"
"Sorry I don't believe in gambling."

That crazy thing is after all this, he actually looked it up on his phone, which emphatically proved I was correct, but his reading comprehension was so bad he thought it proved him correct. First line of the Wikipedia article: "Dinosaurs are a diverse group of reptiles of the clade Dinosauria that first appeared during the Triassic period." There are many more such lines, but he clung to this one: "Although the word dinosaur literally means "terrible lizard", the name is something of an etymological misnomer; even though dinosaurs are reptiles, they are not lizards, nor are they descended from them." I tried to point out this merely says they're not lizards, but still, he insisted they weren't reptiles because of this. I even asked what are they if not reptiles but got no answer. I don't know if he just absolutely refused to be wrong about something or he was really that dumb.

The guy claiming Oregon was mostly black was probably dumber, but he at least admitted he was wrong when somebody looked it up. But again, I got no money.

There have been hundreds of similar situations, though typically the other person is not as hilariously wrong, but they never take my bets. I guess I should be like "I don't know. I think dinosaurs are reptiles but I don't really remember. Want to place a wager? It's just a little fun."

Quote:
Originally Posted by ZuneIt
Works for question: Are there more stars in the galaxy than trees on earth. You say galaxy, they hear/think universe.
That's tricky in and of itself...I wouldn't take that bet because I have no clue about the number of trees, but if I were guessing i'd actually be inclined to say stars in the galaxy. Hmm...Wikipedia says 100-400 billion stars. And...trees on earth is around 3 trillion (recently discovered, previously thought to be 400 billion), so roughly 10 times as many trees. But I bet the answer will reverse itself in a few hundred years, since we remove about 10 billion net a year, with that number escalating exponentially over time. Trees are going away a lot faster than stars.

I think most people just have no clue how many stars there are in the Milky Way or how many trees on earth.

And so I can pretend on I'm on topic:

@RawBeeG

No problem, let me know if you have other questions about SPR, effective stacks, etc.

Oh, and I hate to be the one to tell you this...but...the bees are dying. I'm so sorry.
Straddle raising to 10X in the dark Quote

      
m