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Should Hero Triple Barrel on this this River?? Should Hero Triple Barrel on this this River??

10-27-2017 , 10:10 AM
Fold Pre....Yes I know....Fold Pre would have been the best option to avoid this spot. With that being said, please critique my flop, turn,and river play.

Reputation of Hero, LAG youngish white male. Has had 3-4 showdowns during session with hands that Hero has either 3-bet, called a 3-bet, or 4-bet. Hands were either AK (twice, both times the winning hand) and AA (oddly enough, chopped the hand with opponent on a KQJ66 runout, opponent also had AA).

Reputation of Villain: Mid 30's Aggressive White male. Usually buys in for or near the max (75% max buy rule in the game).

Villain in UTG+3 open to 15 in a 1/2 game with a $4 dollar straddle.
Folds to Hero on Button, with 85
Hero elects to 3-bet to $50.
Folds to Villain who calls with about $750 behind, hero covers

Flop ($107): J76
Villain ($735): Checks
Hero ($1,350): Bets $65
Villain: Calls

Turn ($237): J763
Villain ($670): Checks
Hero: ($1,285): Bets $145
Villain: Calls

River ($527): J763J
Villain ($525): Checks
Hero ($1,140): ???

I think Hero should continue this flop 100% of the time so I am not too worried about the flop bet, could maybe sized a bit bigger, but overall I think Flop play is fine.

Turn I am on the fence whether Hero should have bet, or checked behind to realize equity with open ended SD and FD.

River: Bet 50-65% pot for value bluff, Jam as a bluff, or wave the white flag. What do you all think is best play here?


Also Fold Pre....Fold Pre.... Fold Pre....
Should Hero Triple Barrel on this this River?? Quote
10-27-2017 , 10:19 AM
I see a lot of J in V's range. You're repping an over pair so I expect to get looked up by any J. I probably shut it down.
Should Hero Triple Barrel on this this River?? Quote
10-27-2017 , 10:27 AM
I think I would have checked turn with all of those outs, but I don't mind a bet because you have all of those outs -- even nicer if you hit to build that pot a little and you should have some fold equity.

River I can go either way. If he's aggressive, I don't think he has a pair bigger than J, and would he really check/call flop and turn and check river with a J (or better)? I think I bet/fold $225 - $275. I think value-looking bets often look scarier than jams.
Should Hero Triple Barrel on this this River?? Quote
10-27-2017 , 10:44 AM
Hand would have been totally fine if you stuffed turn
Should Hero Triple Barrel on this this River?? Quote
10-27-2017 , 11:07 AM
You already know that the three bet pre is a little ambitious.

Flop and turn are both fine. On river I'm giving it up. We don't really rep anything except a set by shoving river. Opponent is likely to have a J. We block most of the draws he could have, so by betting you are either hoping he's been slow playing AA-QQ and will fold now that the J came or he had one of the three combos of 89s. Seems too narrow although I could get behind a stupid bet like $75 aimed at purely folding out the three 89s combos.
Should Hero Triple Barrel on this this River?? Quote
10-27-2017 , 11:25 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Avaritia
Hand would have been totally fine if you stuffed turn
Agree turn is where to win this. PSB on turn is best option to win unimproved.
Should Hero Triple Barrel on this this River?? Quote
10-27-2017 , 11:33 AM
Being on the button doesn't give you license to play trash. 85o is trash and 85 is still trash, actually suited trash.

3betting lite should include hands that are not premium but have "equity-when-called" that can hit straights above and bellow the Ten. A hand like T9s. Another lite hand would be A5s that has some big card value equity, straight and flush equity. Anyway, 85s is absolute trash and if you play that way and another experienced player reads you for a "weak raise" with a wide range ... wtf?. You get in deep trouble because that player will eat you alive many times over.
Should Hero Triple Barrel on this this River?? Quote
10-27-2017 , 09:46 PM
don't like pre.

hand value: 2 gappers make so many gutshots, you're just going to have so little equity going post flop.

turn i like the barrel. we only need villain to fold a small part of the time to make this bet profitable and on a J62 board, he can be peeling the flop with any pair or pocket pair, even ace highs.

river, i hate these spots. it doesn't make much sense to bomb this river because we are so polarized. like others have said, we are repping an over pair and is AA/KK/QQ going to bomb this river pairing the Jack?

that said, our opponent doesnt know that. really depends if villain will fold hands worse than a jack on the river.

don't you think villain would bet trip jacks or better on the river fearing you would check it back with your "overpair"?
Should Hero Triple Barrel on this this River?? Quote
10-27-2017 , 10:06 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Avaritia
Hand would have been totally fine if you stuffed turn
The guy that loves opening 3x UTG wants to stuff 3x PSB on the turn?

Explanation needed.
Should Hero Triple Barrel on this this River?? Quote
10-28-2017 , 05:56 AM
The 3! Pre is very ambitious unless you know villan folds to the 3! Often.
Flop is fine.
Turn is fine.
Shut down the river, there just isn't any draws that villan calls the flop with, and any pair under the j he folds on the turn, villan has a jack herr almost always Imo and never folds.
Should Hero Triple Barrel on this this River?? Quote
10-28-2017 , 06:13 AM
Check back river.
Should Hero Triple Barrel on this this River?? Quote
10-28-2017 , 07:35 AM
Need to bet the turn because we hit a barrel card. A lot of better hands would have folded to the turn barrel.
Any hand that called the turn probably won't fold to this river card.
Should Hero Triple Barrel on this this River?? Quote
10-28-2017 , 07:52 AM
If the villain is really "aggressive," then I'd be worried when he's just calling down. From his perspective, you're capped at an OP. He won't believe that you are betting out a set on the flop. He might fold QQ to a shove, but other than that, he's calling.
Should Hero Triple Barrel on this this River?? Quote
10-28-2017 , 08:34 AM
Bigger everywhere
Should Hero Triple Barrel on this this River?? Quote
10-28-2017 , 01:25 PM
pre is probably bad
smaller flop
bigger turn
nut low river to bluff
Should Hero Triple Barrel on this this River?? Quote
10-28-2017 , 01:51 PM
Not your board, so I don't like the suggestion of betting more on each street. More pre for sure though.

AP give up as you eclipsing his folding range + he hasn't shown any aggression on a board that he easily could/should have when you bet turn. He may, as a result, be capped at 1 pair, but I do not expect him to fold what is likely 99/TT/QQ given your image+this river - especially when you lose JJ combos on the end. He also still has lots of Jx that must ck the river.
Should Hero Triple Barrel on this this River?? Quote
10-28-2017 , 02:15 PM
Agree with above. Time to give up on river.

You have to think a street ahead. As you're placing your turn bet in, you have to decide if you're going to triple barrel on a brick. If the answer is yes, you're usually better off sizing your turn bet a lot bigger. Often times, you'll end up betting a smaller amount in total but with larger FE on the turn. You're also still building up a larger pot to set up a shove/third street of value if you hit. A win/win/win.

As far as pre: I'd be interested in hearing more of why you're being viewed as LAG than the hands you described. If you really do think you're showing a loose image, then this is a terrible 3b. If you showing down a few hands at the very tip top of your range in a short time period is why you said they see you as LAG, then that's not a LAG at all and this 3b is less terrible. I don't think 85s can never be 3b, but due to its lack of equity it's really a hand you only want to 3b against a player who has a high fold to 3b% with wide opens or a player who opens wide but folds easily preflop if they don't nail top pair+.
Should Hero Triple Barrel on this this River?? Quote
10-30-2017 , 09:23 AM
Hand Result:

Hero Tanks for about a minute, then goes all in.
Villain Tanks for about 3 minutes than makes a crying call with KK to win.

I didn't feel good about making the all in bet. I put him on one of 3 hands between AK, QQ, and KK. I felt AK would fold for sure, QQ would be 50/50, and KK would probably call. I didn't feel that there would be many Jacks in his range when the river paired. If he had flopped a set, I think he would have raised earlier in the hand either on turn or flop.

I hated making the bet as I knew there was a good chance it would not work in this situation. I should have shown more discipline and just waved the white flag.
Should Hero Triple Barrel on this this River?? Quote
10-30-2017 , 09:36 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by HawkesDave
Agree with above. Time to give up on river.

You have to think a street ahead. As you're placing your turn bet in, you have to decide if you're going to triple barrel on a brick. If the answer is yes, you're usually better off sizing your turn bet a lot bigger. Often times, you'll end up betting a smaller amount in total but with larger FE on the turn. You're also still building up a larger pot to set up a shove/third street of value if you hit. A win/win/win.

As far as pre: I'd be interested in hearing more of why you're being viewed as LAG than the hands you described. If you really do think you're showing a loose image, then this is a terrible 3b. If you showing down a few hands at the very tip top of your range in a short time period is why you said they see you as LAG, then that's not a LAG at all and this 3b is less terrible. I don't think 85s can never be 3b, but due to its lack of equity it's really a hand you only want to 3b against a player who has a high fold to 3b% with wide opens or a player who opens wide but folds easily preflop if they don't nail top pair+.
I like your advice on betting bigger on the turn, I think maybe a bet of $185 - $200 would be good. Then shoving the river wouldn't be a full pot size bet and would probably look a bit stronger in general compared to the $65/$145/ $500 line I ended up taking.

In general, I was planning on shoving most rivers that hit/missed me. The board pairing the Jack caught me off guard and was a river that I did not plan accordingly for.

The hands that has went to show down during this session are not why I think the table would consider me a LAG. I have a decent history with most of this table having played with two thirds of the table at least 15 times.

A leak in my game that I have been trying to improve upon recently is playing too many suited 1 gappers and 2 gappers. I've been focusing on either folding these hands more often or 3 betting them instead of just flatting every single time. This time I elected to 3 bet the hand on the button. In hindsight, I'm not sure this player would fold enough preflop to make this 3-Bet worthwhile, so I probably should just fold.

Probably not worth a flat in position hoping the SB and BB tag along?
Should Hero Triple Barrel on this this River?? Quote
10-30-2017 , 09:40 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by HUMBLE.
don't like pre.

hand value: 2 gappers make so many gutshots, you're just going to have so little equity going post flop.

turn i like the barrel. we only need villain to fold a small part of the time to make this bet profitable and on a J62 board, he can be peeling the flop with any pair or pocket pair, even ace highs.

river, i hate these spots. it doesn't make much sense to bomb this river because we are so polarized. like others have said, we are repping an over pair and is AA/KK/QQ going to bomb this river pairing the Jack?

that said, our opponent doesnt know that. really depends if villain will fold hands worse than a jack on the river.

don't you think villain would bet trip jacks or better on the river fearing you would check it back with your "overpair"?
I do think he'd probably bet a Jack on the river, and a set would probably have raised the turn imo. That was one of the reasons I decided to unsuccessfully bet the river.
Should Hero Triple Barrel on this this River?? Quote

      
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