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The Real LLSNL: Typical Donkalicious Hands The Real LLSNL: Typical Donkalicious Hands

09-18-2012 , 09:19 AM
at the room i play in, i actually think the average female player is better than the average male player.. i think this is mostly because most of the girls there are regs, seems to be less girls that just go to gamble and piss away $ for the hell of it. most of them are still donks, but most players at live low stakes are donks so I don't think this is saying much. but the one edge i think female players have on men is that they seem to tilt less, and make less egotistical spewtard plays going after a single player. never met a good female player that played LAG or non-ABC though.
The Real LLSNL: Typical Donkalicious Hands Quote
09-18-2012 , 09:35 AM
I've rarely crossed swords with the women that play at my casino.
This example is BBV, Donkalisciousness and anti-erotica all at once.

I'll never forget one hand in a big Omaha tournament against this woman who was terrible, all blonde Venezuelan big cleavage fingernails and lipstick and no pot-odds.

We were on the bubble, 8 left with a prize pool of about 8k. I pot preflop with ATJ4. 3 callers including Venezuelan bimbo on the button.

Flop TJ6

I pot with an SPR of 2, bimbo shoves. I call.

She shows 55K7, she looks aghast at my hand, and squawks, "creia que tenias proyecto de escalera!"

The 5 of ****ing comes on the turn, the river bricks like a ****, and she starts to clap and squeal, leaving me staring at her bouncing, heaving exposed chest with confused feelings of cold blooded revulsion, until I was asked to leave the table.
The Real LLSNL: Typical Donkalicious Hands Quote
09-18-2012 , 10:15 AM
Monkey tilt nit

I think this says it all. I've seen time and time again super nits go on mega tilt after receiving a bad beat / loosing a big pot after overplaying a big pocket pair postflop. They play super tight poker, they finally get the hand they were waiting for and lose and then they open up like crazy.

Quite profitable
The Real LLSNL: Typical Donkalicious Hands Quote
09-18-2012 , 10:29 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by rockshoxbh
Monkey tilt nit

I think this says it all. I've seen time and time again super nits go on mega tilt after receiving a bad beat / loosing a big pot after overplaying a big pocket pair postflop. They play super tight poker, they finally get the hand they were waiting for and lose and then they open up like crazy.

Quite profitable
This is related to becoming emotionally attached. I've seen many a nit go crazy after an aggressive player breaks up their nice friendly game. When someone starts taking you out of your game don't get mad. Adjust and get their stack. I love it when the old woman gets pissed at me overbetting all in and then a few minutes later does it herself with crap to teach me a lesson. It's fun to stack her chips as she wonders what the odds were that I just happened to have a hand that time.

Play with emotion but don't think with emotion.

Last edited by spikeraw22; 09-18-2012 at 10:31 AM. Reason: F my phone and latex!
The Real LLSNL: Typical Donkalicious Hands Quote
09-18-2012 , 11:26 AM
I know I played this hand terribad...just couldn't range villain properly

V1: 1st level player, only looks at his two cards, I tilt him because of my accent and because he thinks I am a donkey, stacked him before with QT vs his Q5 on QQxxx board, and with K7 vs his 66 on 77439 board. He never folded to any of my preflop raises.

V2: Extreme nit, knows how to use his image to buy small pots. Will take stabs when no one is interested.

V2 (150$) limps UTG
2 limpers
Hero (400$) limps HJ with 65
V1 limps SB (350$)


Flop (15$) J56
V1 checks
V2 leads for 7$
2 folds
Hero calls
V1 raises to 27$
V2 snap folds
Hero calls


Thought Process:
V2 is betting to use his image (bet sizing tell), and even if he has a hand, he knows my game, any raise here will be taken as really strong and he folds almost everything. I think he folds AA here if he has AA (yes he always always limp/reraises AA), So I just call hoping he will stab at it again ott...
V1 c/r is kinda weird...usually I will view this as a set, but I block two sets, and he is never ever limping JJ in the SB. I don't think he limps J6 or J5 but maybe soooted so meh.
I think his range has a bunch of J8-QJ kinda hands.
I think according to this post-analysis, I should've raised his raise here, and it will look kinda FOS which combined with him tilting from me would result in good things.
Anyway, I decided to call, and raise almost all turns.


Turn (75$) 7
Hero checks
Villain grabs a random stack of chips - bets 45$
Hero calls


I got all MUBSY now...I have no idea where I am at in game, looking back at the hand, I think I am butchering it flop, turn and river. The guy's hand is super face up. I couldn't use the info. Kinda like a in-game brain fart.

River (165$) A
Hero bets 65$ as a blocking bet
Villain tank/calls
Hero shows
Villain mucks


Worst card in the deck for my hand, it either makes his hand better, or scares his one pair stupid hand...either way I bet to avoid having to call a big bet, and he calls (probably with a J), terrible bet because it really gets called by hands that beat me the majority of the time
The Real LLSNL: Typical Donkalicious Hands Quote
09-18-2012 , 11:31 AM
he's a nit and you can only put him on 2 combos of sets, and you know he can bluff (probably turning top pair into a bluff, which some players do).

Question is, will he call a raise with top pair, or fold? If he folds, then waiting for the turn gets you another bet.
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09-18-2012 , 11:33 AM
^^ no the hand was against the tilting guy, the nit bet/folded the flop
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09-18-2012 , 11:49 AM
even better, arrrr-in on the flop. Tilting players don't like to fold TP.
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09-18-2012 , 11:54 AM
well all in will be a massive overbet...looking back at it, a flop raise is by far the best option.. .it looks too bluffy given how he views me. ughhh i played this like a fish
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09-18-2012 , 12:10 PM
You have to raise the flop there as you are just crushing their ranges. I probably raise it the first time, but I definitely raise it the second time.
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09-18-2012 , 12:25 PM
Got a piece of it...

1/2 Friday night

V is a young woman who plays in a home game with two other players at the table who are home game bad (and donating generously to the rest of us). V seems to be the best of the bunch but that only pegs her as competent. (In contrast, one of the other guys asked me after about an hour of sitting next to me whether a flush beats a straight.) She has hit some hands and is up to about $350.

Hero has been absolutely card dead for the hour that V has been at the table. I don't think that I have raised once and I am pretty sure that I have not won a hand. I have $270.

Hero is dealt JJ in UTG+2. I raise to $12.
Two MP callers, V calls from SB, BB calls.

Flop ($55): J107
Check, check, Hero bets $40, fold, fold, V calls, fold.

Turn ($135): 6
V checks, Hero bets $75, V calls.

River ($285): 7
V checks, Hero goes all in for $143, V calls.

V mucks when she sees Hero's full house but says she had a seven. Let us assume she had A7, probably offsuit.

Analysis
Villain's first big mistakes are pre-flop. First, she probably figured she was "priced in" to call the $12 bet after two other people called. The fact that A7 is almost always crushed here after a raise and two callers does not enter her mind. Second, she is playing the entire hand out of position so even if she were to hit some miracle flop, her ability to get paid is severely compromised. Third, and most importantly, I had not raised a hand in the past hour and now I am doing so from EP. JJ is probably the lowest part of my range, based on what she has seen from me so far.

The flop comes and she falls into the title trap ("I got a piece of it"). I c-bet and she figures that I could be bluffing (into four callers semi-OOP ) or that she could hit an A or another seven, so she calls. She never considers what I may have and how her pair of sevens is doing against that range. The turn is more of the same, although she now has half the odds of catching a miracle card (that, in fact, does her no good whatsoever). The river comes, she gets her miracle card...and she pays off the remainder of my stack.

Last edited by sao; 09-18-2012 at 12:27 PM. Reason: Added title
The Real LLSNL: Typical Donkalicious Hands Quote
09-18-2012 , 05:31 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by dgiharris
I wonder if Mr. Solid falls into the above category?
I suspect that he did.

Quote:
When that club peels off on the turn, and she raises, her hand is face up as a made flush. I mean, we aren't talking runner runner back door here and its not like there is an Ace on the board. So how does Mr. Solid miss that?
He missed it because he wasn't paying attention. He was too busy playing with his MP3 player. When out of hands, he was watching college football on the TV's (at least I think that's what was on, I don't recall because I wasn't watching TV). He was gawking at that game when a short stack to his immediate left raised $12 pre, PYL reraised what he had left to force out the remaining players to play two red tens HU against the short stacker. He had Big Slick, but the tens held up.

Where was Mr. Solid? He missed everything because he'd rather watch football. Any player who can iso-raise like that isn't playing fishy.

Quote:
Well, what I find to be a reason among many male players is that they just don't respect female players and this goes double for younger/hotter female players
Then they'd do better not playing them at all. Maybe most of the younger/hotter female players aren't very good, but it's an error that's likely to prove costly if they assume wrong, and don't see how these (or any other) player is actually playing.

It's a mistake I see all the time, and have been seeing it for quite some time -- one I resolved early on never to make.
The Real LLSNL: Typical Donkalicious Hands Quote
09-19-2012 , 01:18 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by djz
i raise to 600 with 86ss in MP hoping to isolate the really bad player. he always seems to pay me off for whatever reason. well, he pays everyone off.
this seems like the wrong player to isolate with eight high
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09-20-2012 , 02:07 PM
I don't know how to play this hand post flop. I shove!

Villain is a very bad player who has no idea his is true. Villain looks at his cards utg and open shops for $150. Folds to hero.
What is your calling range given that villain is the classic deer in headlights player?
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09-20-2012 , 02:13 PM
98+ ?
The Real LLSNL: Typical Donkalicious Hands Quote
09-20-2012 , 02:13 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by spikeraw22
I don't know how to play this hand post flop. I shove!

Villain is a very bad player who has no idea his is true. Villain looks at his cards utg and open shops for $150. Folds to hero.
What is your calling range given that villain is the classic deer in headlights player?
QQ+ AK+
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09-20-2012 , 02:43 PM
never calling this guy with AK, because his range is usually like 99-QQ with sometimes KK+ and AK. I'm calling QQ+ unless he makes it a habit
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09-20-2012 , 02:59 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Black Aces 518
never calling this guy with AK, because his range is usually like 99-QQ with sometimes KK+ and AK. I'm calling QQ+ unless he makes it a habit
+1. Why even take a flip with AK when there will clearly be much better spots? I might also call with JJ since I believe that terribad players are more likely to spazz shove with 88-TT than with AA or KK.
The Real LLSNL: Typical Donkalicious Hands Quote
09-20-2012 , 03:01 PM
I just threw in the AK because some tilting villains don't know how to play AQ other than that
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09-20-2012 , 03:11 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by playertee
I just threw in the AK because some tilting villains don't know how to play AQ other than that
Agreed but villain needs to be expressing signs of tilt and/or give me a reason to think he's doing this somewhat light
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09-20-2012 , 03:37 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by spikeraw22
I don't know how to play this hand post flop. I shove!

Villain is a very bad player who has no idea his is true. Villain looks at his cards utg and open shops for $150. Folds to hero.
What is your calling range given that villain is the classic deer in headlights player?
It's been my experience that when clueless players open ship $150 then it is:

Clueless Nits: AA
Aggro Gambooler: 22+, AJs-AK
Clueless Donks: 99-AA, AK
Ego Maniacs: ATC
Clueless MUBsy players: AA
Clueless ABC players: AA/KK 90% AA 10% KK

So imo its not a one size fits all... You have to know what kind of player you are up against. Even though a player is "clueless" they still have a profile and player type.

I'm often surprised how there will be an OBVIOUSLY MUB Nitty player who open ships 100bb from UTG and how quickly "thinking players" will snap call them with JJ/QQ or AKs... And then they are surprised when the MUB Nit turns over AA...

We have to remember that the majority of our villains are donks. And the majority of ABC type donks absolutely HATE the thought of losing a hand with AA. They are pathologically afraid of losing with AA and they are fond of saying "I hate getting my AA cracked" and then they delight in showing AA after they raise everyone out and then pat themselves on the back for their "correct play".
The Real LLSNL: Typical Donkalicious Hands Quote
09-20-2012 , 04:07 PM
The more I think about this, I have been playing 1-2 times a week live for the past two years so probably about 700 or 800 hours and I can't think of a single time a player has open shoved 75BB. Plenty of $30 opens (JJ 50%, AA 50%) and plenty of shortstack (<$70) open shoves (double or nothing time!) but I can't remember a single person randomly open shoving a decent size stack. I don't play in Vegas or AC regularly so I see fewer newbie tourist types.

How often do you see this, dgi? Others?
The Real LLSNL: Typical Donkalicious Hands Quote
09-20-2012 , 04:32 PM
I've only seen it from this one player to this degree, but I see the mentality ALL the time. Overbett ing pre for fear of the flop or maybe a more common spot, massively overbetting a flop with an overpair if there's even a hint of a draw available.
These players ensure that they win the min most of the time an lose the max once in a while. Their fear of variance when they "should" win prevents them from obtaining meaningful profits from hands that good players will see massive profits from in the long run.

Last edited by spikeraw22; 09-20-2012 at 04:33 PM. Reason: F my phone. Latex blows!
The Real LLSNL: Typical Donkalicious Hands Quote
09-20-2012 , 05:51 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by sao
The more I think about this, I have been playing 1-2 times a week live for the past two years so probably about 700 or 800 hours and I can't think of a single time a player has open shoved 75BB. Plenty of $30 opens (JJ 50%, AA 50%) and plenty of shortstack (<$70) open shoves (double or nothing time!) but I can't remember a single person randomly open shoving a decent size stack. I don't play in Vegas or AC regularly so I see fewer newbie tourist types.

How often do you see this, dgi? Others?
I saw a guy go aipf about 10x in one night for 250bb, I imagine he would have continued if I didn't stack him. I'd say I see,this a few times a month for 100bb every now and then they do it blind.
The Real LLSNL: Typical Donkalicious Hands Quote
09-20-2012 , 05:57 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by sao
The more I think about this, I have been playing 1-2 times a week live for the past two years so probably about 700 or 800 hours and I can't think of a single time a player has open shoved 75BB. Plenty of $30 opens (JJ 50%, AA 50%) and plenty of shortstack (<$70) open shoves (double or nothing time!) but I can't remember a single person randomly open shoving a decent size stack. I don't play in Vegas or AC regularly so I see fewer newbie tourist types.

How often do you see this, dgi? Others?
I play 90% 2/5nl 10% 1/2nl and I see this probably once per 6 hrs of play.

Usually it goes something like limp-limp-limp-limp then action falls on the clueless MUBsy nit and he/she opens for $85 - $125, everyone folds and then nit shows AA and says "I hate getting Aces cracked." and then goes on to expound on their brilliant philosophy that is confirmed by the other nit-donks at the table.

The other time I see it is with an Aggro ego maniac when he is new to the table. He open shoves after a limp-limp-limp fest pot and then after everyone folds he shows ATC so the table sees how awesome he is.

Overall i'd say its about even 50/50 between the maniac and the nit. So knowing the player type is 100% vital to whether or not you raise or fold.

Lastly, when the open is $85 ish from a Veteran Reg then it is 99-JJ almost always.
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