I play LAG pretty well, but in the last couple of sessions I have been getting my #$% handed to me by these loose passive players. How in the world can one beat the game when 8 out of 9 players see the flop every single time. I have the rule of opening when I am first in the pot if I have a playable hand in these type of games, the problem is that even after opening to an appropriate amount every single player still calls. They only 3! when they have AA or KK, limp with AK, QQ, JJ, 10 10, etc.

TPTK gets smoked by a funky two pair combo:
Two pair always gets beat by a flush or a straight:

Is this variance? Should I just find a better game where people bet when they have a hand? Is there really a better game to be at though? Am I being overly aggressive by opening my hands that are top 20%?

If you can't figure out how to beat games where 8/9 see a flop then I'm afraid you aren't a "good LAG".

Sounds like a dream game

Fold!

I am just ranting here, my real thoughts are, am I opening too much with just 20% of my hands or do I need some sort of adjustment here? Am I experiencing a downswing with negative variance when my TPTK gets beat by K5off on the river? I am betting and putting pressure on them, they just keep calling. I usually beat this game for a good amount.

have you considered sizing bigger if they're calling too much???
I mean sometimes you are going to lose with the best hand/strategy... if you can't learn to deal with it it's probably best to avoid poker

1. If you're getting called by the entire table, make larger raises.
2. Value bet the bejeezus out of TPGK+.
3. Make peace with variance.

This game sounds amazing. I can has invite?

The fact this game bothers you is so trivial I assume almost all your situations are seen as face up and can play optimally. Fold more often instead of always paying off, raise bigger until you find a breaking point to limit number of opponents, bet bigger on streets when you got top of range

The simplest part of the adjustment is tightening up your range. Facing a bunch of very loose passive villains don't be loose preflop and don't try to push them out of flops post. Aim for the more careful end of TAG. Cut down on the number of callers by raising more. The more you have to raise the tighter your range should be.

If the nut peddler doesn't fold the flop don't build a big pot unless you can beat one pair. You get most of your value from these guys by raising big preflop and having them fold the flop when they miss.

Current limping thread addresses some of these issues, imo. For instance, I would question why you'd open any hand at all at a table like this. It's a pretty polarizing thread, imo.

FWIW, having all 9 opponents call a $20 raise preflop when you have a a big TP hand with a $200 stack isn't necessarily the dream table you think it might be (especially if all these opponents are competent postflop). But that again might be a pretty polarizing statement.

GcluelessNLnoobG

The two bolded things specifically, and one other...really tighten up preflop in EP so you aren't stuck playing EP more than you want.

I think I know the exact type of table you're talking about.

Super-passive preflop, and a bunch of calling stations post-flop, right? If that's the way it plays, then it shouldn't matter that it's a limped pot in order to get stacks in post-flop.

See lots of flops cheap with pocket pairs and suited cards, nut mine (sets and flushes) the * out of them, PSCBet flops, overbet turns and shove rivers if you get there.

Maybe I'm just not good enough post-flop, but it seems like playing LAG when half the table are calling stations is just setting money on fire.

If all of your opponents are competent postflop, the #1 priority should be a table change IMO. 8-9 regs hunting 1 fish isn't how we make any money in poker.

Strictly my noob opinion ofc.

Wait...so in your scenario with an SPR of 1 with top pair (presumably at least GK) and...you're worried about being outplayed post?

I'm not necessarily going to go so far as to say this spot isn't profitable, but it isn't as massively profitable as those are making it out to be.

I'm flying blind with my TP/overpair, and yet I'll probably have to get my stack in on the flop. Everyone else knows exactly where they are and can play perfect. Even KJs played well by a competent player (who saw a flop to flop two pair / trips / draw / etc.) will probably be sane enough to get away from just TP (especially if the preflop raiser is looking to get it in eleventeen ways).

I'll likely take down enough of these huge pots on the flop / fade the breakeven flush draw that is willing to get it in with me / suck out against the two pair / etc. to make up for the times I ship into opponents with better hands, but it's not exactly printing nearly as many $$$ as we think. Especially compared to, oh I dunno, limping in, seeing a raise to $20 and 7 calls, and then shipping it preflop and taking down a massive amount uncontested / unraked (which is likely far more EV).

Gimo,andI'llnodoubtbeoutvotedonthismatterG

100% agree.

Gunfortunately,thatisn'talwaysanoptionG

I think OP should post an example of a hand he played well as a LAG that others would have played worse.

This.

1) Stop over-valuing TPGK multi-way. And...

2) Raise more preflop to thin the field. I find that in my 1/3 game with multiple limpers I am frequently raising to $25-$30 and still often getting one or two callers. If I had 7 limpers I'd be making it $40+ pre with a TAG opening hand selection.

Or you can go GG's way, and look to mine the nuts yourself. I think that is less EV but still +EV. As long as you remember rule #1.

if your a LAG why are you letting 8 players see a flop?
So does this mean if you're not first in the pot you join the limpers?
Nothing "always" happens in poker. A winning player that you say you are should know that.

There's a big difference between playing a LAG style and playing too many hands. I would suggest posting hands to see where you're making mistakes or overplaying your one pair hands.

raise bigger
tighten up front starting hands
loosen late starters and raise bigger like $35-50
a true LAG should be able to read where they are at better.
throw your phone in the river and pay attention .
do they play better post flop ?
lastly where's this game I want in!

Setintostraight answered it, and I'm going to lock it up before it gets trolly. OP, if you want to read more, we used to get one of these "how can I win if no one folds" threads every couple of months.

You've already got your answer, though.